December 31, 2007
Bhutto Assassination Weapon ID'd?
On December 27, Pakistani police
recovered a pistol from the scene of Benazir Bhutto's assassination in Rawalpindi, Pakistan.
I tweaked the low-res version in PhotoShop, rotated it 90 degrees, and played with the color balance to provide better contrast. Here is the modified, rotated photo, inset into the original.
I emailed that "green" photo this morning to Confederate Yankee commenter "karlJ," who has worked in the region as a contract medic, who thinks it could be a Steyr M 9mm pistol.
Based upon the shape and angle of the grip and the angled rear of the slide (which makes it distinct from similar polymer-framed Glock, Springfield XD and M&P pistols), I think that "karlJ" is probably correct.
Barack Obama has yet to link the pistol to Hillary Clinton's vote on the Iraq War.
Update:
Photo editor William G.S. Smith, seems to think that the ID of the assassination weapon as a Steyr M is positive, and sends along this comparison.
01/02 Update: Hey, Nuts. The truthers at whatreallyhappened.com have linked to this post to float the theory that the shooter was Pakistani special forces:
Now guess who uses the Steyr M 9X19mm handgun exclusively - the Pakistani army - special forces division.
An interesting theory... and completely divorced from reality.
I can find zero evidence that the Steyr M has been purchased by any branch of the Pakistani military in an online search... not so much as a single pistol. Pakistani police units bought a limited number of the old Steyr GB pistol in years past, but there is no confusing the two handguns, and the folks at whatreallyhappened.com apparently just decided just to make up a story about the M being "exclusive" Pakistani Army SF issue to float a witless conspiracy theory... shocking, I know.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
01:45 PM
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Post contains 304 words, total size 3 kb.
1
there is no evidence that any bullets hit bhutto.
the video shows no blood, and it shows her moving her arm VOLUNTARILY, up and back as if to voluntarily move back into the vehicle.
she does not slump-down.
the scarf is not moved by a bullet.
if she'd been hit then she'd have slumped and there'd be blood on the scarf and a splatter we;d see - as from JFK in the zapruder film.
the movement of her arm is dispositive to me.
rewatch the video.
let your eyes do the thinking and not the msm.
Posted by: reliapundit at December 31, 2007 02:35 PM (BpRBS)
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Does that use square backed rounds?
On a serious note, is the Steyr a standard sidearm for the Army, police or security teams over there? I checked Wiki, and all I found was that the Army uses Steyr rifles for sniper duty.
Posted by: doubleplusundead at December 31, 2007 02:58 PM (P17op)
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Pistol bullets do not cause the dramatic sort of damage you saw in the Zapruder film except in movies. People do not always immediately slump when hit, even in the head. There is frequently not even enough blood immediately visible from the outside for the shooter to know he was making hits.
The incident took just a second or two between impact and her being pulled into the car. Having seen many gunshots over my career, foreign and domestic, the fact that there is no immediately visible blood or instant incapacitation is no evidence the victim wasn't shot.
I make no claims beyond that.
I have never seen a Steyr pistol over there, but that doesn't mean anything as everything is available to any organization with the money.
Posted by: karlJ at December 31, 2007 04:18 PM (Kg2UJ)
4
I checked with Beauchamp and TNR and was told that their anonymous sources were "absolutely positive" that the Steyr uses "square cartridges" and "square barrel" and is "exclusively carried by Pakistan Army Special Forces".
I have been told that TNR has "damning and inside information on the assasination" and will be running a special piece on it in their next issue. TNR also believes that "the issue will be so damning to the Pakistani President and informative on what is 'really' happening in Pakistan, that all 6 of their readers will buy a copy."
Posted by: WB at December 31, 2007 10:59 PM (yR9hl)
5
Here is the link to the initial picture of the gun reported by Geo TV:
http://www.humsurfer.com/view/image-of-the-gun-that-killed-benazir-bhutto
Related story is here: http://www.humsurfer.com/view/image-of-the-gun-that-killed-benazir-bhutto
Hope this helps.
Thanks
Abid Jan
Posted by: Abid Jan at January 02, 2008 10:33 PM (NEYl4)
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Jay R. Grodner, A Chicago Lawyer You Should Know
Jay R. Grodner is a Chicago lawyer who apparently believes it is perfectly acceptable to
vandalize a deploying Marine's car because of his own anti-war political beliefs.
Of course, the best way to handle the situation is by letting the authorities do their jobs, and commenter "Mo" at Blackfive has the excellent idea of contacting the Illinois Attorney Registration & Disciplinary Commission:
One Prudential Plaza
130 East Randolph Drive
Suite 1500
Chicago, IL 60601-6219
(312) 565-2600 or, within
Illinois, (800) 826-8625
Fax (312) 565-2320
One North Old Capitol Plaza
Suite 333
Springfield, IL 62701-1625
(217) 522-6838 or, within
Illinois, (800) 252-8048
Fax (217) 522-2417
It would seem that committing felony vandalism is a decent reason to have his license to practice law revoked.
The post also cites a police report that Grodner also apparently tried to state that the Marine only accosted him because he's Jewish (implying the Marine is a bigot).
Stay classy, Jay R. Grodner, Chicago attorney.
Bonus: He's already a big hit on Google.
I hope he enjoys the free advertising. He's earned it.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
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1
What's ironic is that that sort of publicity will probably drive more anti-war whackos to become his clients.
Posted by: C-C-G at December 31, 2007 08:58 PM (ojkss)
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At this rate, the SOB won't have a buisness for much longer.
Posted by: Foxfier at January 01, 2008 11:52 AM (D/3gQ)
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What is especially funny is that everyone jumps to the "he did it because he is anti-military" conclusion as if he as a man who bills several hundred bucks per hour has nothing better to do than walk around looking for military license plates so he can vandalize their cars.
Simple fact: the Marine was a douche for backing down a one-way, but certainly didn't deserve anything more than a "hey, obey the traffic laws!" yell. Of course the lawyer guy reacted in a criminal way. If it had been me that he had seen, he would have said "You think that just because you're tall, intelligent, and incredibly handsome, you can do whatever you want." To assume that he only did it because of the military plates is quite short-sighted and conspiracy-minded.
Posted by: Book Learned Guy at January 01, 2008 05:57 PM (+Dl24)
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BLG, in order to prove that, you'd have to show that Mr. Grodner made a habit of keying cars who had violated traffic laws.
Without such data being provided, the conclusion that the Marine's Department of Defense license plates were a primary reason that Mr. Grodner picked his car to key is valid.
Also, if you'd read the B5 article that CY linked to, you'd know that the Marine reports that Mr. Grodner said, "you think you can do whatever you want with Department of Defense license plates and tags." That statement, if true, is also strong evidence for the conclusion that Mr. Grodner's anti-war feelings were a motivating factor in choosing to vandalize a Marine's car.
Good day, sir. I said,
good day.
Posted by: C-C-G at January 01, 2008 06:54 PM (ojkss)
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the Marine was a douche for backing down a one-way Uh huh. That bastard!
To assume that he only did it because of the military plates is quite short-sighted and conspiracy-minded. It isn't assuming when Grodner stated upon being caught "You think you can do whatever you want with Department of Defense license plates and tags"
Reading is your friend, Book Learned Guy. You should do more of it, preferably before writing.
Posted by: Pablo at January 01, 2008 06:55 PM (yTndK)
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Without such data being provided, the conclusion that the Marine's Department of Defense license plates were a primary reason that Mr. Grodner picked his car to key is valid.
BTW, these were not DOD plates, but
Illinois Specialty Plates. But Grodner seems to have confused that which leads to the next obvious question: Did Grodner think he was vandalizing DOD property? That would be tremendously stupid, and a federal crime.
Posted by: Pablo at January 01, 2008 06:59 PM (yTndK)
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This lawyer, is a douchebag.
I'll even go so far to say that anyone DEFENDING his actions, is also a douchebag.
Seems to be an excess of douchebaggery on the left these days.
Posted by: Conservative CBU at January 01, 2008 07:22 PM (La7YV)
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Either way, Pablo, it's indicative of Grodner's anti-war and anti-military bias and therefore, plausible motivations. That's the only point I was trying to make.
Posted by: C-C-G at January 01, 2008 07:32 PM (ojkss)
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Yeah, I gotcha C-C-G. I'm just pointing our that this guy may be even dumber than it seems at first look. It almost a shame that he wasn't right about it being a DOD vehicle.
Posted by: Pablo at January 01, 2008 08:48 PM (yTndK)
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Ahh, now I get where you were headed, Pablo.
Yeah, that is a shame. But he was probably counting on President Hillary to pardon him if it was a DOD vehicle and he got caught. (evil grin)
Posted by: C-C-G at January 01, 2008 09:13 PM (ojkss)
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Guy probably has a framed autographed picture of Alexis Fecteau on his night stand.
Posted by: Purple Avenger at January 01, 2008 10:42 PM (ERV3B)
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Anyone really surprised an anti-war democrat would key a Marines car?
Posted by: Capitalist Infidel at January 01, 2008 10:55 PM (Lgw9b)
13
mayhaps someone ought to get into the cook county court tracking system so that this nit could be greeted every time he comes to court.
as to his feeling persecuted because he says he is jewish, someone ought to find out what synagogue he goes to and send letters containing the story to the rabbi and to the board. this did not happen because he is jewish---and as a vet I would love the opportunity to discuss it with him publicly.
Posted by: velvel in decatur at January 02, 2008 12:41 PM (cOYYN)
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as a vet i have noticed that this is how libs "support the troops"
Posted by: ozzzy4444 at January 02, 2008 04:25 PM (qGMwR)
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o.k. my mom just pointed out to me that i am not a vet, i am a dependent (not the same thing), (my bad) however my point remaines valid.
Posted by: ozzzy4444 at January 02, 2008 04:39 PM (qGMwR)
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"as if he ... has nothing better to do than walk around looking for military license plates so he can vandalize their cars"
It was probably more along the lines of a "crime of opportunity" coupled with a momentary failure of his "better judgment" circuit not filtering the "stupid" from the "rational".
"Simple fact: the Marine was a douche for backing down a one-way..."
You don't live in Chicago, doya? Never spent much time there, dijja?
Backing down one-way streets is a common occurence ... to get to parking spots or because you missed -- as this jarhead did -- the address of his buddy. It's not like this was an alleyway we're talking about, here, it was a normal Chicago street, two lanes wide with parallel parking on both curbs. It's just one-way. Backing down a one-way isn't a real hazard, and it doesn't indicate much in the way of "douchery", since pretty much everyone who owns a car in Chicago does it, more or less regularly.
Posted by: rwilymz at January 03, 2008 12:47 PM (2KK9O)
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I find it funny that "Book Learned Guy's" most descriptive word for the marine is "douche."
Apparently the book he reads is "The Frat-Star's Guide To Chugging Beer and Passing Out."
And I don't buy BLG's theory that if it had been him the lawyer saw would have said "You think that just because you're tall, intelligent, and incredibly handsome, you can do whatever you want."
Book Learned Guy may own books, but probably not any mirrors.
Posted by: Chicagoan at January 03, 2008 03:34 PM (8Lg5R)
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A bigoted Jew and a lawyer.
How disgusting!
Posted by: Max at January 04, 2008 12:14 AM (Y/e75)
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Disbar him. Another example of the corrupt legal system.
Posted by: Ron at January 04, 2008 09:09 AM (AiJXe)
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This guy should be DISBAR and still brought up on charges What ass hope the Attorney General can do something
Posted by: Jack at January 05, 2008 01:01 AM (zpOhj)
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THE MARINE DID WHAT HE WAS TAUGHT TO DO: ADAPT, IMPROVISE AND OVERCOME - http://soldiersmind.com/2007/06/03/adapt-overcome-and-drive-forward/
You see, there are a lot of people living in this country who have NEVER worn the uniforms of service to the United States of America. Therefore, they do not understand the concept of "Adapt, Improvise and Overcome." We, the special few who have served in uniform and in combat situations understand this concept totally. We survive because of it. We know that those things that are difficult take a little longer to "fix." We also know that the impossible takes a little longer...But, we get the job done....SEMPER FI, MARINE!!!
Posted by: jOHN at January 05, 2008 12:37 PM (AiJXe)
Posted by: Bubba at January 05, 2008 06:09 PM (RygMp)
23
Regardless of whose car it was, Grodner feels (knows?) he can commit a crime and then work the system and not be held responsible for his actions. Is he right? The AG's office has that answer.
Posted by: MSgt(ret) at January 05, 2008 09:48 PM (lCq3w)
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This worthless officer was, correctly, immediately removed from any position of responsibility. Now someone needs to make sure he leaves with a less-than-honorable discharge to ensure he never gets back in to retire.
This was not a one-time thing, but a six-month pattern of illegal behavior that disgraces his uniform and embarrasses all those who wear it.
The taxpayers paid this douche for his ability to lead men in combat and serve as an example of honor & fidelity. The key issue here is: would you trust this asswipe to lead YOUR kids in combat?
End of discussion. The real shame is that no one noticed his character flaws earlier.
Posted by: MSgt G. L. W. at January 06, 2008 03:53 AM (VSMyZ)
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Isn't it odd how the back-patting AG's Office considers it "too time consuming" to follow-up on a valid, open complaint of flagrant felony vandalism voiced from a taxpaying citizen (as well as a defender of our nation), but that same AG will no doubt allow thousands and thousands of frivolous, time consuming civil cases to clog our court system day after day because that's what keeps their fellow lawyers rich, rich, rich beyond their wildest dreams.
Whoever that AG or DA was that made that stupid, narrow-minded and self-serving comment deserves to be disbarred as fast as that mope Grodner should be as soon as he is convicted.
This soldier should be served with a subpoena to appear in court, and the Marine Corps needs to honor that subpoena to allow justice to be served for him here in the United States just as his service in Iraq provides them there with the same.
This outhouse lawyer needs to know that his kind is not above the law simply because he's a little more adept at playing the game. MSgt G. L. W. also needs to back-off and regroup with the hysterical rhetoric as well, unless he can provide clear-cut evidence of wrong on the part of the Officer in question.
Respectfully Submitted,
An Old US Army Soldier from the 'Burbs.
Posted by: beanhead54 at January 06, 2008 12:45 PM (PMOxQ)
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This lawyer is a jerk and a waste of skin, but it's unfair and illogical to make him the poster boy for liberals, Democrats, or those who oppose the occupation of Iraq. If he'd vandalized a car with an anti-war bumper sticker, I wouldn't assume any conservative or Republican would commit the same crime.
I'm against the occupation, but I'd never do that to anyone's car, and certainly not to someone risking his life to serve my country. It's abhorrent, and indefensible. But using the actions of one imbecile to attack millions of others for their opinions is hardly patriotic or American.
Posted by: Just My Opinion at January 06, 2008 10:52 PM (9kfFD)
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MSgt G. L. W. -
Are you a Marine / Solider / Airman? Would like to know. I personally know Mike, his brother Bill and some of their friends. I am a former Marine of ten years. Your post shows your true character. A wimp.
This Marine, is a man of undisputed character and courage. He has been voluntarily in harms way as a Marine Reservist and volunteered to go back (which he is in the process of doing) to Iraq. Has seen numerous front line altercations.
For you to make a statement that this officer (he is a Sgt, not an officer) and suggest that his honor and fidelity are in err, only makes me confident that you are presenting your post and self under the false solider act. You should watch your course. You could be libel.
I would personally send my children to war with Mike and his brothers. They are why we have what we have. Freedom, not tryanny.
Watch your mouth faker. We have this biggest faternity ever known and are well connected. Bigger than Notre Dame or any Ivy league school. Its called USMC. We take care of our own.
Enough said
Posted by: teeitup at January 07, 2008 07:18 PM (QiL5C)
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Some of us want to express our opinions to Mr. Grodner directly, but his website is down.
All is not lost, however: If you go to www.yellow.com/white.html and in put his first and last names and his ZIP code (60626), you can find his contact information in case you want to write him or telephone him.
Posted by: Clifton Palmer McLendon at January 07, 2008 09:52 PM (bcsC8)
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Interesting note:
Jay Grodner lives nine-tenths of a mile from a cemetery.
Posted by: Clifton Palmer McLendon at January 07, 2008 11:23 PM (bcsC8)
30
The "NEW" Jay Groder is David Selden of Az. This has to be read to be believed:
Court will hide ID of illegal immigrant employer
A federal court will keep secret the identity of an Arizona business owner who admits in a sworn statement to hiring illegal immigrants.
The business owner, who remains anonymous, has filed an affidavit in federal court saying he was employing people not in this country legally last year when the lawsuit was filed, and he intends to continue to do so even with the new state law that took effect Jan. 1.
That law allows a judge to suspend or revoke any state licenses of firms that knowingly hire undocumented workers.
Attorney David Selden, who represents businesses challenging the law, said the purpose of the affidavit was to prove to U.S. District Court Judge Neil Wake that the law will harm at least one company.
The judge had previously indicated he might not be able to rule on the validity of the law without some proof someone could get in legal trouble for disobeying it.
Selden said the move is justified because the business owner faces both the threat of prosecution if his identity becomes known, as well as the possibility of actual physical harm.
LINK:
http://www.eastvalleytribune.com/story/105888
Here's Dave's info. Call him up and tell him how much you appreciate his efforts, and while your a it, find Dave's home number and post it so others can call him there and tell Dave how much like like his efforts in this are:
http://www.ballardspahr.com/about/lawyers.asp?id=1855
Posted by: Ja at January 08, 2008 12:10 PM (G8g1Q)
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Fred Thompson's Message to Iowa Voters
It's the best I've seen of him since Roger L. Simon and I interviewed him back in November for Pajamas Media.
Thompson offers something different for conservative voters both Democrat and Republican, and than any other contender running this election cycle from either party, in a commitment to the principles that made this nation great.
Are sound, calmly-stated and time-tested principles of leadership enough in a sound-bite focused, poll-driven world? For the sake of our nation's future, I certainly hope so.
Blogger endorsements aren't worth much, but for whatever it is worth, Fred Thompson has earned mine.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
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Impact?
Channel 4 has new video of the Benazir Bhutto assassination that seems to indicate that the former Prime Minister was indeed hit by the assassin's bullet before she fell back into the car (click
Watch this report).
The video, shot from behind Bhutto's vehicle and to the right, shows Bhutto's hair and shawl rise as the pistol discharges for the second time. She drops into the vehicle prior to the suicide bomber detonating. There is nothing in this video to indicate that the first and third shots had any effect.
While the new film shows her hair and shawl moving, however, it is not conclusive.
Unlike the Zapruder-filmed assassination (YouTube) of John F. Kennedy, however, there is not the spray of flesh and bone one might have expected from a pistol blast at near contact range of approximately six feet.
The ballistics expert interviewed by Channel 4, Roger Gray, notes the concussive blast of the bullet hitting her hair and shawl and suggests that it indicates a bullet strike on the left side of Bhutto's head. There were not, however, any direct signs of an invasive impact to Bhutto's skull as seen with Kennedy, just the movement of her hair and shawl. One might think that a bullet hitting Bhutto on the left side of the skull, penetrating, and exiting the right side of her skull would have shown signs of exiting in the form of a spray of blood and bone, which was not evident in the film footage.
So while it is probable that Bhutto was struck by a bullet, it is not conclusive, and the government account of her hitting her head cannot be conclusively ruled out.
Channel 4 was slightly deceptive in their account when they show a sunroof latch from her vehicle and state that there was no sign of blood, implying that the Pakistani government was lying. The government may very well be lying, but the latch they show does not support this; there were two on each side, and Channel 4 is clearly showing the right front latch, while it is the right rear latch that has blood on it and that Bhutto is said to have hit her head on.
It appears everyone is trying to spin the story of Bhutto's assassination for their own advantage, including the media.
Update: Image added.
It is worth noting that if a bullet struck Bhutto a glancing blow and ricocheted away without fully penetrating her skull, that it could possibly leave a wound that would not necessarily look like that of a typical gunshot wound, and instead look something like a blunt force trauma.
If this is the case—and without an autopsy, there are no definitive answers—then the Pakistani government, seeing blood on the rear latch and not seeing evidence of a clear bullet hole, may have incorrectly surmised the cause of death as an impact with the rear sunroof latch as she went down. This is incompetence, but not necessarily a conspiracy to deprive Bhutto of her martyrdom.
In any event, it does not excuse Channel 4 from showing the front sunroof latch and insinuating that there was no blood on any latch, when they clearly took a closeup of the front right latch for their closely-cropped still photo, still in the exact position as shown in the photo above.
Update: AllahPundit's analysis here.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
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Pistols and rifles do not do similar damage. It is not uncommon for pistol bullets to stay inside the cranial vault, but it is unlikely that there would have been visible "spray" even if it had exited..
Posted by: karlJ at December 31, 2007 08:39 AM (Kg2UJ)
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KarlJ said it first. It's not uncommon for .22LR slugs to remain inter-cranial.
Granted I do not know that the weaspon was a .22...
Posted by: dad29 at December 31, 2007 09:37 AM (rcwrA)
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I'd have to disagree with you on that one, karlJ.
I've seen enough crime-screen photos of pistol shots to the head to feel confident in stating that if the weapon used was a 9mm or a
7.62 round like those found in the Tokarev that I think may have been used, we're talking about a bullet moving at approximately 1,100-1,300 fps at the moment of impact, which should be enough velocity to create a visible "spray".
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at December 31, 2007 09:41 AM (vxbTC)
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Dad,
While the channel 4 video masks the gun as it fires, an early video shows the slide cycling as it fires. The amount of pistol movement and the amount visible blast even in daylight would seem to indicate something more substantial that a .22 LR was used.
I suspect a 7.62x25 or 9mm for several reasons, first because of the commonality of these kinds of ammunition in the region, but also because of the size of the pistol, the size of the muzzle flash, and the fact that the 7.62x25, while technically obsolete, is still used as an assassination weapon because while the round has less favorable wound characteristics than most modern cartridges, it will defeat lesser body armor classes because of its enhanced penetration due to using a smaller diameter bullet.
I of course reserve the right to be completely wrong, but in this instance, I don't think that I am.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at December 31, 2007 09:48 AM (vxbTC)
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[For karlJ, by CY]
In my carers as a cop, SWAT medic, ME contract medic and nurse, I've seen the effects of many shootings. If you are expecting the sort of effect seen on the Zapruder film, it is not going to happen. Only on TV do we get that sort of damage from pistol bullets. Pistol bullets frequently stay inside the body, or, especially if they've hit bone, exit with much less energy. Since the round was fired from below, another thing to consider is that what little exit spray there may have been could have been caught in her head scarf.
7.62Tok is a high velocity round compared to other pistol rounds. It still is not fast enough for hydrostatic effects and generally creates a simple through and through wound channel. This is because a round that is designed to penetrate armor is not going to deform in flesh. I have seen this first hand. Most available loads are intended for somewhat longer SMG barrels as well, so flash very dramatically when fired from pistols.
Having worked in various 'Stans, I have to say your caliber assumptions are not correct. Everything is available, though I saw .32ACP, .380, 9mm Mak and 9mm para most often. Muzzle flash is not a good indicator of caliber when using 3rd world ammo which tends to flash more than Western loads, but which can be very inconsistent.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at December 31, 2007 11:38 AM (vxbTC)
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I lean toward the slug ricocheting off the skull. People simply do not understand how common this is.
Posted by: Peter at December 31, 2007 12:58 PM (AiJXe)
7
While it is slightly possible that the shooter and bomber could have been acting alone without knowledge of eachother I think that probably not what happened.
So we actually have 2 suicide attackers. Clearly the shooter knew he would be blown up or shot. I cannot imagine pro Musharaff factions being Islamic Suicide Bombers. Looks like Al Qaida or Taliban.
Posted by: Dennis D at December 31, 2007 01:12 PM (780G9)
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December 28, 2007
Harper's Credibility Issues Return
Over at Powerline yesterday, John Hinderaker stated that Scott Horton of
Harper's libeled the U.S. Army with an anonymous smear on behalf of Iraqi terrorism suspect and Associated Press photographer Bilal Hussein.
It's as incredible an attempt at libel as I've ever seen. No one with any common sense could believe a word of it. That qualification, though, excludes Editor and Publisher, which yesterday republished Horton's libel admiringly, under the headline "Harper's Probes Case of Jailed AP Photog in Iraq. " Some "probe! " Editor and Publisher begins by saying that Horton is "the latest to look at the purported evidence" against Hussein, but that is false. Horton never discusses the evidence, of which he is, as far as his article discloses, entirely ignorant. Beyond that, E & P's crack "staff, " which is credited with its piece, fails to mention that Horton's column is based entirely on an anonymous and highly dubious "source, " and simply quotes Horton's hit-job with evident approval.
Of course, no one expects the left-wing E & P to do any critical thinking, let alone investigation. But it would have taken very little research for them to discover that Scott Horton was, until January, a partner in the law firm that represents Bilal Hussein--a fact that Horton did not find it necessary to disclose to his readers. There is indeed a story here, and one that relates directly to journalism--the kind of thing in which E & P might be expected to take an interest. But political loyalty trumps journalistic standards at E & P.
To sum up: Scott Horton claims to have an anonymous "source" inside the Pentagon, who relayed to him the contents of a DOD briefing on the Hussein case. I think this is plainly false. I believe that Horton has a source, but is it a source inside the Pentagon, or inside Hussein's defense team, headed by Horton's former law partner? If Horton has a "source" inside the Pentagon, who is it? Is this purported source someone with knowledge of the Hussein case, as Horton claims, or is it just another left-winger regurgitating anti-American talking points?
These questions are easily answerable. All Scott Horton has to do is identify his alleged source inside the Pentagon, and give us the details on the "briefing" that his column supposedly summarized. Unless and until this happens, it is reasonable to conclude that Horton, or his source, is lying.
If the name Scott Horton seems familiar to readers of Confederate Yankee, it should; On August 25 of this year, I called him out for a claim he made in a August 24 blog entry he wrote at Harper's called Those Thuggish Neocons, in which he claimed:
I have no idea whether Beauchamp's story was accurate. But at this point I have seen enough of the Neocon corner's war fables to immediately discount anything that emerges from it. One example: back last spring, when I was living in Baghdad, on Haifa Street, I sat in the evening reading a report by one of the core Neocon pack. He was reporting from Baghdad, and recounted a day he had spent out on a patrol with U.S. troops on Haifa Street. He described a peaceful, pleasant, upscale community. Children were out playing on the street. Men and women were out going about their daily business. Well, in fact I had been forced to spend the day "in the submarine," as they say, missing appointments I had in town. Why? This bucolic, marvelous Haifa Street that he described had erupted in gun battles the entire day. In the view of my security guards, with which I readily concurred, it was too unsafe. And yes, I could hear the gunfire and watch some of the exchanges from my position. No American patrol had passed by and there were certainly no children playing in the street. This was the point when I realized that many of these accounts were pure fabrications.
I challenged Horton to produce the "Neocon's" article he claimed to have read in a August 24 email, stating:
can't claim that Harper's is one of my normal stops, but I was very intrigued by your post today "Those Thuggish Neocons, " particularly the paragraph about the reporter who fabricated the Haifa Street report you read.
If you are familiar with my small blog at all (and I'm sure you probably aren't); I often run down false or inaccurate media claims, typically hitting the wire service reporting the hardest, though I've also captured fraud and inaccuracies in newspapers and magazines as well. And yes, I'd readily admit that I have a conservative perspective, but that does not make me so biased that I approach the world with ideological blinders, as this post burning a false pro-Iranian War argument should show.
I was hoping that you would provide me with the date of the story you related as specifically as you can recall, along with the news organization and individual reporter you said was making up this report.
This is pretty obviously unethical and possibly illegal, and I want this resolved quickly.
Horton never responded, prompting my subsequent blog entry to next day.
I repeatedly attempted to get a response from Harper's and emailed Harper's Editor Roger D. Hodge and Managing Editor Ellen Rosenbush on August 27, and again sent email to them, Horton, and Vice President of Public Relations Giulia Melucci on August 29, once more pressing for Horton to produce the report and reporter he claimed to have read during his time in Baghdad.
Again, they refused to respond.
I did not pursue Horton's claims further at that point as I was immersed in the Scott Beauchamp story at the time, but with Beauchamp's stories now retracted by The New Republic and Powerline once again poking holes in Horton's credibility, it seems time to return to the issue once more.
Harper's should come clean on Horton's sourcing for both of these stories, and quickly. If they do not, they seem doomed to wander down the same humiliating path as Franklin Foer and The New Republic.
Update: Chris Muir weighs in:
12/30 Update: I sent another email to Harper's editors and PR person yesterday, and it seems Editor Roger Hodge and Managing Editor Ellen Rosenbush will be out of the office on holiday until they return until January 2. Here's the "meat" of it:
I ask you yet again to compel Mr. Horton to produce the specific article he claims to have read. I think it a quite reasonable request to have a magazine produce source material for a disputed claim, especially when that claim is neither an anonymous source nor classified information, but what Horton himself claims to be a public print media report.
I ask that you please complete this very simple request by Friday, January 4th, 2008, which seems a very reasonable amount of time to produce the article in question, even considering the holiday season.
We'll see how they respond.
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1
I sleep better knowing that you're on the case.
Posted by: happyfeet at December 28, 2007 01:58 PM (qXYKO)
2
The hallmark of much of Horton's writing is his use of unidentified sources. As pointed out in the post at PowerLine, these
"sources" appear to be a bit unlikely to even exist given the comments and the nature of the information that Horton often attributes to them. From the one case in which I had some direct knowledge, it was clear that Horton simply made the stuff up.
Posted by: Terry at December 28, 2007 02:10 PM (d/RyS)
3
I guess al Qaeda pays pretty well.
Posted by: Capitalist Infidel at December 28, 2007 02:48 PM (Lgw9b)
4
Horton is a pompous self-promoting hack. Gardephe was the AP's curious choice of lawyers for Hussein, which no one seemed to understand at the time.
Posted by: daleyrocks at December 28, 2007 03:49 PM (0pZel)
5
I'm not sure this harms Harper's in any degree as the TNR scandal has harmed them not at all. The media just don't care about "facts" at all, much less truth of any discernible character. A hilarious example I recall from the Seattle area search for two suspected terrorist advance men. The editor of the P-I was phoned apparently by a grizzled veteran of the ferry service who, miraculously, spoke (anonymously natch) in exactly the terms and at exactly the position of said editor. Lies on lies again. Great thing about this Horton jackass though is he gives us the solution himself. He says the bloggers etc are of no consequence and hang the questions of Beauchamps stories as he has BEEN ONCE DECEIVED!!! Of course this is lie but we can safely and happily ignore Harper's which will continue to produce modest profits from those foolish enough to buy it.
Posted by: megapotamus at December 28, 2007 04:43 PM (LF+qW)
6
Horton had a prior piece out for Harpers on November 21, 2007 with a similar tone.
http://harpers.org/archive/2007/11/hbc-90001717
Posted by: daleyrocks at December 28, 2007 08:38 PM (0pZel)
7
How much ya wanna bet Horton's source was an old sock on his left hand?
Posted by: C-C-G at December 28, 2007 08:59 PM (4tS0i)
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Most of the people that keep up with political news have figured out that any story that starts with 'according to unnamed sources' is in fact a lie by a media wimp without the ability to report real news. Add 'according to unnamed sources to the list with 'once upon a time' that identifies fairy tales, and 'this ain't no BS' that identifies a war story.
Posted by: Scrapiron at December 29, 2007 12:03 AM (d/RyS)
9
Interesting story. Thanks for caring about this stuff.
While you are looking around, maybe you can follow up on this - I read this Reuters story on christmas day:
http://www.reuters.com/article/technologyNews/idUSL2510281920071225
The part that intrigued me was the last paragraph:
Officials said GLONASS would mainly be used alongside the U.S. global positioning system, which Washington can switch off for civilian subscribers, as it did during recent military operations in Iraq.
As far as I know, the U.S. has never "turned off" civilian parts of the GPS system (although I have heard rumors it gets kinda fuzzy around selected sites in the U.S.). This Reuters "news" article sounds more like a way to scare potential users of the U.S. system to the Russian system.
Thanks
Posted by: Penzance at December 29, 2007 12:43 PM (/5FL+)
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On a related note, these this story: http://rawstory.com/news/2007/Gitmo_detainee_faces_psychological_struggle_after_1227.html about an Australian jihadi.
The story makes it sounds like he spent all his time in Guantanamo. This contradicts a report I heard on BBC World Service that described how he'd spent a year in US hands, followed by five yeas in a maximum security prison just outside Adelaide.
Posted by: Patrick Carroll at December 29, 2007 01:27 PM (bWO3Z)
11
10:1 you're just seeing the tip of the iceberg here rather than a couple of isolated incidents. Integrity appears not to be a word in the modern lexicon.
Posted by: Purple Avenger at December 29, 2007 07:13 PM (ERV3B)
12
Purple Avenger: The ends justify the means. They're fighting for a Higher Purpose. It's Important that they Stop The War and Stop George Bush and Stop America. It doesn't matter how they do it, it Must Be Done. By Any Means Necessary. Their faith in God makes their actions pure. Kill them all, God will know his own.
Posted by: DensityDuck at December 30, 2007 10:18 AM (V2EJB)
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Duck, they don't believe in God. They have faith in Themselves (with a capital T). Other than that, you're absolutely correct.
Posted by: C-C-G at December 30, 2007 10:45 AM (ojkss)
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Penzance; As usual it appears Reuter's reporters have no idea what they are talking about. What could be switched on and off was a system to generate random errors of up to one hundred meters for civilian users. In 2000 it was ordered that the error system no longer be used. They also get wrong the time it was used unless their idea of recent includes the original Gulf War of 1991.
Posted by: Fritz at December 30, 2007 10:51 AM (zzYah)
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I hate to agree with megapotamus, but he's right. This won't hurt Harper's.
Mainstream media reporting has become little more than story telling. And, the story is a morality tale stamped with the MSM's own particular brand of left wing morality.
Harper's and TNR will continue to return profits for much the same reason that the Harry Potter series continues to return profits to J.K.Rowling. To many (perhaps to most), their fictions are more comfortable/palatable than is reality.
Posted by: 555JM at December 30, 2007 11:38 AM (nsJTX)
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Scott Horton recently authored a long piece in Harper's accusing a US Attorney of prosecuting a Democrat trial lawyer for political reasons. Horton had no facts or justification for this outrageous charge, of course. He just felt comfortable smearing a courageous prosecutor for having the temerity to convict a high-rolling Mississippi Democrat contributor for buying judges. Horton's smear was gaining traction until Uber-Big-Time-Dem-Mississippi-Trial-Lawyer Dickie Scruggs was caught by the FBI -- guess what? -- trying to buy a Mississippi judge.
Posted by: Doyle54 at December 30, 2007 02:29 PM (8BjOz)
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Penzance, you are correct in calling a foul on the al-Reuters GLONASS story. The US did not turn off GPS for Afghanistan or Iraq and Reuters should not be parroting Russian sales propaganda. The Russians are primarily targeting Europe with that statement because the Europeans went off and decided to build their own GPS system called Galileo precisely because of this nonsense built around anti-Americanism (especially anti-American Department of Defense who runs GPS). The Europeans are still trying to build Galileo because getting the Europeans to agree on the system design and production is like trying to get Congress to agree unanimously on their favorite color. So, Russia is saying "Hey, we already got one and we won't turn it off. Hehe."
Posted by: doc75 at December 30, 2007 07:17 PM (tVSYc)
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"Hey, we already got one and we won't turn it off. Hehe."
Right in all respects....they won't turn it off just like the won't turn off the flow of natural gas into Eastern Europe. Oops, I forgot; they did do that already.
Posted by: Terry at December 30, 2007 08:21 PM (d/RyS)
19
MSM response:
What? You want
us to be accountable?
No, no, no, you've got it all wrong. We hold
other people accountable. We're not accountable for anything.
Posted by: TallDave at December 30, 2007 08:54 PM (/XDWj)
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What Killed Bhutto?
In a nation where conspiracy theories run a freely as water, a new statement by the Pakistani government that PPP leader Benazir Bhutto was
felled by sharpnel from a suicide bomber and not from the assassin's bullets is sure to be greeted with skepticism.
It was initially reported that Bhutto, 54, was killed on Thursday after a public rally in Rawalpindi by the bullets of an assassin who blew himself up after firing the shots.
But the surgeon who operated on her, Dr Mussadiq Khan, told the Associated Press on Friday that Bhutto was killed by shrapnel from the blast -- from which at least 28 more people died and at least 100 were wounded. Khan said "no bullet was found in her body."
An account by IBNlive.com provides a murkier accounting:
Mystery shrouds the death of former Pakistan prime minister Benazir Bhutto. In an explosive revelation, Pakistan's Interior Minister Hamid Nawaz on Friday said that Bhutto did not die of bullet wounds.
Nawaz said that Bhutto died from a head injury. At least seven doctors from the Rawalpindi General Hospital – where the leader was rushed immediately after the attack – say there were no bullet marks on Bhutto's body.
The doctors have submitted a report to the Pakistan government in which they say that no post-mortem was performed on Bhutto's body and they had not received any instructions to perform one.
"The report says she had head injuries – an irregular patch – and the X-ray doesn't show any bullet in the head. So it was probably the shrapnel or any other thing has struck her in her said. That damaged her brain, causing it to ooze and her death. The report categorically ssyas [sic] there's no wound other than that," Nawaz told a Pakistani news channel.
Government sources say there will be an investigation to determine why no autopsy was conducted.
These accounts from doctors seem to directly conflict with that of John Moore, a Getty Images photographer at the scene that stated clearly (audio & slideshow) that Bhutto was shot and went down into the armored vehicle before the assassin detonated his suicide bomb.
Transcript:
...suddenly—well, I turned around and heard three shots go off, and saw her go down, um, fall down through the sunroof, down into the car, and just at that moment, I raised my camera and started photographing with the high-speed motor drive and that's how I was able to capture some of the explosion, and the aftermath...
Other witnesses at the scene concur with Moore:
Three to five shots were fired at her, witnesses said. She was hit in the neck and slumped back in the vehicle. Blood poured from her head, and she never regained consciousness. Moments after the shooting, there was a huge explosion to the left of the vehicle.
A pistol was recovered from the site of the assassination by Pakistani police and is assumed to be the assassination weapon, but the likelihood of a person firing with a pistol rapid-fire from an estimated 50 yards while in a crowd, and hitting his target seems remote.
This would seem to bring us back to the irregular patch on Bhutto's head once again:
"The report says she had head injuries – an irregular patch – and the X-ray doesn't show any bullet in the head. So it was probably the shrapnel or any other thing has struck her in her said. That damaged her brain, causing it to ooze and her death. The report categorically ssyas [sic] there's no wound other than that," Nawaz told a Pakistani news channel.
If the multiple eyewitnesses were correct and Bhutto was back down inside the armored vehicle before the suicide bomber detonated his explosives, then there is little possibility that she was killed by shrapnel. There is also little reason to suspect that the seven doctors who examined her in the IBNlive.com article would lie about there being no signs of a bullet wound.
So what killed Benizer Bhutto? What could cause blunt-force trauma severe enough to kill the former Prime Minister, and occur before the bomb detonated, at which point multiple witnesses state she was already back inside the armored vehicle?
While merely speculating, I think that when shots were fired (they missed), her security detail pulled her back inside the vehicle quickly, and she probably hit the back of her head on the sunroof edge as she was pulled in.
That would seem to account for the lack of wounds other than blunt force trauma, though it would be very hard to prove without an autopsy that was never performed.
Update: The U.K. Sun seems to have come to an identical conclusion. CNN has the story as well.
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Jeeze, did they hire the examiner who looked at Vince Foster?
No one told them to do an autopsy, so they didn't?
Between that and the riots that seem to be targeting random people, trains and buses, I just have to say Pakistan isn't ready for prime time.
Posted by: Mr. Obvious at December 28, 2007 03:22 PM (+jnQm)
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Judging only by what I've read here (and my decades of experience as a firearms instructor), 50 yards is indeed outside the realm of possibility for all but the most skilled shooters under much calmer conditions than those present at the time of Ms. Bhutto's murder. Handguns are, for all practical purposes, effective at 25 yards and less, and while a 50 yard shot to the head or neck of a medium sized woman is possible, in that contemporary weapons and ammunition are up to that level of accuracy, under the scenario presented here, such a feat of marksmanship would be far more blind luck than skill. Consider that there are many documented gun battles where police officers and criminals have literally emptied their handguns at each other--and missed--from distances that would have allowed them to simply reach out and touch their opponent.
No doubt we'll need to know much more to render any kind of meaningful judgement on this.
Posted by: Mike at December 28, 2007 06:06 PM (/vNsr)
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Does it matter how (technical cause of death) she died?
This is a serious, non-rhetorical question. Regardless, her death is tragic on an individual level and could end up being tragic for Pakistan and the region as a whole. However, does the exact cause of her death change the post-assassination dynamic?
Some have criticized the Pakistani government - and even the Bush administration - for not properly protecting her. Stating that it was inexcusable to let an assassin get that close to her. However, if it turns out that the reaction of her personal security force or her own reaction to the shooting was the specific cause of her death, does that change things?
I honestly don't know, and I'm not trying to play blame the victim. I don't know if Mrs. Bhutto would have been the long-term solution that people are now claiming, but she had the courage to put her self in the line of fire and regardless of the actual cause, the underlying perpetrators of the assassination are to blame.
Posted by: JD at December 29, 2007 02:41 AM (1QwF+)
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"but the likelihood of a person firing with a pistol rapid-fire from an estimated 50 yards"
Where do you get 50 yards? There's a picture out showing the gunman holding the pistol at most 10 feet away from her.
Posted by: Molon Labe at December 29, 2007 08:43 PM (kYpqT)
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There is a slide show over at HuffPo that shows pics of the roof latch with blood on it and also a shot of the bloody interior of the vehicle.
Both are consistent with the doctor description of the fractured skull described by the doctors present.
Others who washed the body say they saw bullet holes.
Looks like this is going to take a while playing dueling story lines to be sorted out.
Posted by: JustADude at December 29, 2007 09:00 PM (1aM/I)
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Isn't it possible that the blast could have caused her skull to impact the roof or sunroof of the car?
Posted by: doc75 at December 30, 2007 07:38 PM (tVSYc)
Posted by: C-C-G at January 01, 2008 05:04 PM (ojkss)
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December 27, 2007
The Best of Liberal Minds
Dave Lindorff has a nearly perfect pedigree as a liberal journalist.
He's a 1975 graduate of the Columbia University Graduate School of Journalism, a two-time Fulbright Scholar, and a contributor to the New York Times, The Nation, Salon.com, and the co-author of The Case for Impeachment: The Legal Argument for Removing President George W. Bush from Office.
He's also the author of a Dec. 22 op-ed in the Baltimore Chronicle & Sentinel entitled, "Global Warming Will Save America from the Right...Eventually."
This gem of a post was dug up by Allahpundit at Hot Air, and is a masterstroke of what someone might call liberal fascism... if such a thing ever existed.
It begins:
Say what you will about the looming catastrophe facing the world as the pace of global heating and polar melting accelerates. There is a silver lining.
I'm all for good news... aren't you?
Look at a map of the US.
Here you go (will open new window).
Centered on Great Britain, you can drag it over to the U.S., and then use the drop-down in the top left to see what would be submerged under X meters of sea level rise. I'm using 14+ meters, as it is the greatest rise the program is set to calculate, and it has the added bonus of giving Mom and Dad near-riverfront property. Put the rise at 14+ meters, and then read the following, which has been helpfully annotated with links to this map not found in the original post, which will show the flooding for each area mentioned.
The area that will by completely inundated by the rising ocean—and not in a century but in the lifetime of my two cats—are the American southeast, including the most populated area of Texas, almost all of Florida, most of Louisiana, and half of Alabama and Mississippi, as well as goodly portions of eastern Georgia, South Carolina and North Carolina. While the northeast will also see some coastal flooding, its geography is such that that aside from a few projecting sandbars like Long Island and Cape Cod, the land rises fairly quickly to well above sea level. Sure, Boston, New York and Philadelphia will be threatened, but these are geographically confined areas that could lend themselves to protection by Dutch-style dikes. The West Coast too tends to rise rapidly to well above sea level in most places. Only down in Southern California towards the San Diego area is the ground closer to sea level.
Please, take your time and follow the links. Worthy of the kind of writing we associate with the New York Times, The Nation, and Salon.com, Lindorff gets almost everything wrong.
Contrary to his statements, the area traditionally considered the southeast takes relative few hits to population centers. Take in the order they were presented, Texas loses Brownsville, Corpus Christi, Galveston and Port Author, but the rise in sea level would leave Houston a beachfront resort, and Austin, Dallas, Fort Worth, and indeed, probably 95% of the state untouched. Florida would take big hits as almost every major coastal city slips under the waves, but Orlando and Mickey are safe, as it the majority of the center of the state from Arcadia, north. Louisiana loses about a third to half (not most) of its territory, and despite his bold pronouncements of "half" of Alabama and Mississippi being under water, the 14 meter sea level rise would hardly make a dent outside of coastal areas, except for a finger darting up from a recently-expanded Mobile Bay to just south of Jackson, Alabama.
As for the Carolinas and Georgia, we'd lose Savannah and Charleston and Wilmington, but other than that, weÂ’d lose mostly rural areas already predisposed towards being swamps.
In short, everything he said about the inundation of those hated "red states" he so reviles ranges from horribly inaccurate to outright wrong.
But perhaps more interesting is that his beloved bi-coastal libospheres fare just as poorly.
Lindorff is perhaps correct that Boston, New York and Philadelphia may well be saved by costly "Dutch-style dikes", but I'll keep in mind that they are far more likely to go under themselves... both literally and financially. You must remember that these are the same folks that brought us the "Big Dig" which, by the way, will also flood.
But what about the areas Lindorff didn't mention?
He forgets to mention the huge inland lake that will turn Sacramento into California's Dead Sea. He also forgets to mention what happens to those along the Chesapeake peninsula, or all the coastal cities in Delaware (buh-bye, Wilmington) and the Jersey shore, and... oh well, Newark isn't that great of a loss, is it? At least no greater of a loss than the southern third of Long Island, Bridgeport and New Haven, Connecticut, and all those other annoying little picturesque villages from there up through Maine.
In plain English, we'd all take significant hits, and despite his poorly-researched conclusions, damage to "red" states in his dark fantasy are greatly inflated, and damage to low-lying areas of "blue" states would also be severe.
In true Columbia Journalism School-educated fashion, however, Lindorff is only beginning to show his stupidity.
He continues:
So what we see is that huge swaths of conservative America are set to face a biblical deluge in a few more presidential cycles.
Then there's the matter of the Midwest, which climate experts say is likely to face a permanent condition of unprecedented drought, making the place largely unlivable, and certainly unfarmable. The agribusinesses and conservative farmers that have been growing corn and wheat may be able to stretch out this doomsday scenario by deep well drilling, but west of the Mississippi, the vast Ogallala Aquifer that has allowed for such irrigation is already being tapped out. It will not be replaced.
So again, we will see the decline and depopulation of the nation's vast midsection—noted for its consistent conservatism. Only in the northernmost area, around the Great Lakes (which will be not so great anymore), and along the Canadian border, will there still be enough rain for farming and continued large population concentrations, but those regions, like Minnesota, Wisconsin and Illinois, are also more liberal in their politics.
Finally, in the Southwest, already parched and stiflingly hot, the rise in energy costs and the soaring temperatures will put an end to right-wing retirement communities like Phoenix, Tucson and Palm Springs. Already the Salton Sea is fading away and putting Palm Springs on notice that the good times are coming to an end. Another right-wing haven soon to be gone.
So the future political map of America is likely to look as different as the much shrunken geographical map, with much of the so-called "red" state region either gone or depopulated.
Oh, he can dream, can't he?
All those annoying "red" states unlivable, unfarmable, and depopulated, with America's breadbasket a vast desert. He seems absolutely giddy at the thought of liberal elitists being left alone and presumably in charge of what remains. Let's let him cherish his malformed conclusions as he savors the vengeance of the earth mother on those nasty rubes who have caused him so much electoral heartache.
There is a poetic justice to this of course. It is conservatives who are giving us the candidates who steadfastly refuse to have the nation take steps that could slow the pace of climate change, so it is appropriate that they should bear the brunt of its impact.
The important thing is that we, on the higher ground both actually and figuratively, need to remember that, when they begin their historic migration from their doomed regions, we not give them the keys to the city. They certainly should be offered assistance in their time of need, but we need to keep a firm grip on our political systems, making sure that these guilty throngs who allowed the world to go to hell are gerrymandered into political impotence in their new homes.
There will be much work to be done to help the earth and its residents—human and non-human—survive this man-made catastrophe, and we can't have these future refugee troglodytes, should their personal disasters still fail to make them recognize reality, mucking things up again.
It should be considered acceptable, in this stifling new world, to say, "Shut up. We told you this would happen."
Why, you almost need a Sawzall to cut through moral superiority this thick.
Unfortunately, reality will intrude on poor Mr. Lindorff's eliminationist fantasy yet again.
He seems to forget that farming in arid regions is indeed quite possible if the need arises, and so those nasty Midwesterners that keep ruining national elections for him will not, in fact, die of starvation.
Nor are they likely to come crawling eastward to become the neo-slave-class he envisions.
Nor does Lindorff seem to be able to grasp the even more obvious fact that if times do become hard, those farmers and ranchers in the Midwest and Southeast that he so clearly reviles are going to feed themselves and those around them first. Those in the overpopulated elite bastions of liberal metropolitan thought, hidden behind leaky dikes with little farmland of their own, will be those least likely to be fed.
Perhaps as starving natives of south Philadelphia begin stoking a caldron to a boil in hopes of rendering his frail body into a passable gruel, one of them will remember his article, and snarl at him, "Shut up. We told you this would happen."
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1
A waste of a very good mind. Dave was a Merit Scholarship finalist in high school. He is simply continuing his high school pattern: I'm cool and I'm bright,and you are not, and I know a lot more than you will ever know.
Like some people say, life is but a continuation of high school
Posted by: EOSUberAlles at December 27, 2007 05:08 PM (2SWLa)
2
I am so unbelievably UPSET. Just think, my home (currently @ around 5500 ft above sea level) might actually be approximately 42+ feet closer to sea level. My GOD! The horror! Here I was hoping I might actually have a chance at 'beach-front property'.
/sarc off
For those commenters here...I'm in Wyoming, right next to the Rockies. CY's statement about those mid-west farmers feeding their own first is extremely correct, as well as the Western ranchers. I've always been amazed by the urban crowd's capacity to think wheat, corn, vegetables, and MEAT - come from a supermarket...all nicely packaged with plastic wrap and labeled for them. Not only that...but where does most of the POWER (electrical, oil, Nat. Gas, etc) come from that allows them to heat/cool their homes, cook their food, etc.
I have a sneaking suspicion that at least one of Mr. Lindorff's conclusions is a bit dyslexic. The move won't be to the cities...it will be away from them.
I'm even more depressed that I couldn't find a comment link for the editorial...and even more depressing - where's the irony that "Flushing" won't be completely flooded with a 14m sea level rise?
Posted by: Mark at December 27, 2007 05:21 PM (4od5C)
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Bad science. Bad, bad case of BDS. Which has resulted in really horrible analysis. The peace loving, liberal mind at its best. Scary isn't it?
Posted by: CoRev at December 27, 2007 05:34 PM (0U8Ob)
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Like the old ad said, "A mind is a terrible thing to waste." That is, assuming he ever had one. The rising sea level (TM) may not get this clown, but he may drown in a pool of his own sanctimony.
Maybe he decided not to save this drivel for 2008 so that he could garner some support for 2007's ignorant rant of the year.
Posted by: Chris at December 27, 2007 05:37 PM (8Uryu)
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Mark's totally correct... in southwest Iowa, a 45-foot rise in sea levels won't do much for us. Should we run into food shortages, you can be assured our families will be fed first. Actually, in our case, we'll also enjoy the wine and hard cider from the grapes and apples we produce on our farm.
As a professional risk manager, I'm intrigued that anyone could be as educated yet so seriously lacking in any pragmatic perspective or life experience. Clearly advanced journalism or social science degrees have no utility as it led to the conclusion that a city is a safe shelter while those closest to food production and natural resources would be in jeopardy. How we as a society failed to educate Mr. Lindorff in such basics, while worse yet, leading him to believe he was obtaining advanced education in essentially useless, phony fields, should signal alarm. Even more detrimental is the false confidence these unprepared, economically useless individuals have. Should we have real hardship (e.g. a real depression they appear to seek from their nihlistic views), do they think they'd last a month? These "contemplators of grand thoughts" and "men of letters" would be the first to go in any hardship where utility and productivity was the measure.
Strictly from a risk perspective, cities are not natural environments and subsequently have serious distortions that cause bad things to suddenly become very bad (e.g. auto-collinearity). Tell me how you'll be taunting us hicks when your water supply fails, or when your week food supply disappears. Cities magnify food and resource risk where rural living tends to diversify it. On our farm, we've even kept one well totally pre-electric so we could have a reliable water supply in the event of a long-term outage. Ask yourself how many Bostonians can fend without city or bottled water for three days, let alone months? Seriously... where would YOU go for water if there was none in the pipes or the stores? Would you, like nearly every city dweller, be completely at the mercy of the government? I'd suggest Lindorff and most others on the left may need to re-read the story of the grasshopper and the ants.
Increasingly, liberalism has become associated with disfunctional, borderline clinical personality disorders. It's not only a disfunctional, non-working model, but it's increasingly associated with deranged followers who find attraction to its irrationality. Lindorff's writings are more a commentary on how society is failing to help treat those in significant need of assistance, and the perpetration of a liberal ideology unfortunately allows these illnesses to be masked in a great many people.
Posted by: redherkey at December 27, 2007 05:51 PM (kjqFg)
6
with little farmland of their own
Now c'mon, everyone knows that every good lib has an organic cherry tomato plant on his or her patio.
Posted by: Sara at December 27, 2007 06:07 PM (Wi/N0)
7
redherkey:
I've got beef...you've got wine. Wanna set up a barter or just a BBQ?
Sara: and they will enjoy their just desserts...or is that deserts...I forget...
PS: and for those who might think the "city-folk" will just take the food they want from us, remember, we still have our guns and we know how to use them. Now, if they want to set up 'equitable trades', I'm all for it
Posted by: Mark at December 27, 2007 06:39 PM (4od5C)
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I'd love if Raleigh was about an hour or more closer to the ocean.
We could dike off those liberal mecca's then cut the bridges.
Seriously, is there anything out there that liberals aren't hysterical over nowadays?
Posted by: William Teach at December 27, 2007 06:46 PM (NaHh8)
9
Let's see: He wants to wipe out most of coastal America, see tens of millions of people dispossessed, maybe hundreds of thousands dead (between direct and indirect-starvation and disease-causes), watch an ecological disaster of unbelievable proportions unfold as salt water overruns millions of acres of biosystem (not to mention the human-related causes as thousannds of chemical plants and oil handling, refining, and storage facilities go under corrosive saltwater), have America's economy totally destroyed for maybe fifty years- which will totally destroy the rest of the world's economy too, and spark a civil war on top of it all...
... and he feels there to be a silver lining,
making everything okay, because it means that his ideological bent will emerge triumphant in national politics without the trouble of having to convince people to vote his way.
Have I got it right? I'd hate to think I've missed something.
Posted by: DaveP. at December 27, 2007 07:21 PM (1AZTv)
10
Mark: sounds like we could have a heck of a BBQ. We sure love smoking ribs and chicken too (as well as the obligatory veggies you gotta throw in). Try a Strongbow or a K brand hard cider some time - that's mostly what we're growing apples to produce a comparable domestic version of.
Sara: The only potted plants I know my lib city slicker friends grow don't make veggies (but they allegedly have medicinal value from what I've been told).
Seriously tho, I've been getting involved in mentoring at our school more and am doing a lot with my son's scout troop on American business and such. We've got to reach out and give these kids a chance to understand objectivity before these alternate mental state leftists get their hands on them.
I'd encourage readers here to consider the thought. If more of us help kids become more aware of how the world really is, and be less fearful of taking on real academic challenges instead of the soft and mostly useless poly-sci/history/english/journalism degrees, our country will be a better place.
Posted by: redherkey at December 27, 2007 07:32 PM (kjqFg)
11
Only a lefty could consider the deaths of millions of people to be a good thing. No wonder they deify Stalin and Lenin.
Posted by: C-C-G at December 27, 2007 07:41 PM (4tS0i)
12
wait! Wait! WAIT!
You're looking at the wrong map of the USofA!
Get a copy of the famous "Red-Blue Map" from the election a few years back that shows those U.S. counties which voted predominantly Democrat in Blue and mostly Republican in Red. Notice that the closer you get to the water, the "bluer" the county becomes, and the more you move away from the water, the "redder" the vote!
Liberals/Democrats are along the waterfront, the Atlantic/Pacific Coasts, the Mississippi River, the Great Lakes, etc. The "conservative" reds are farther inland, on higher ground!
He may be correct in identifying the geographic consequences of Global Warming, but he is completely wrong in identifying the demographic consequences.
It's almost enough to make me want to believe. ;-) ;-) :-)
Posted by: JCPennylegion at December 27, 2007 08:14 PM (tNTnZ)
13
This idiot is a poster child for the fact that streetsmarts are always greater then booksmarts. If something bad happens to this country idiots like Dave Lindorff will be totally lost. The only thing he knows how to do is BS his fellow liberals.
I remember a passage in Stephen King's book "The Stand" where one of the people was dying from appendicitis. One of the characters asked them all what their college majors are/would have been. Then she pointed out that all they learned is how to BS each other and none of them actually KNEW how to do anything and were afraid to try. The only one who actually knew how to do things and was willing to try was Stu Redman, who before the superflu they would have all looked down on a a stupid, ignorant redneck. She then stated that she would trade the lot of them for a couple more people like Stu.
Posted by: Ennis at December 27, 2007 09:08 PM (JfS+L)
14
What's with everyone here buying into Lindorff's wildly delusional exaggeration of the sea level rising 14 meters (45.9 feet) in two cat generations? Those who take interest in predicted sea levels can Google up a bunch of numbers from various sources and find that by the year 2100, the oh so wise scientists have furrowed their brows and come forth with these ranges of rise from the present:
Science Daily (2002): 0.4 to 1.4 ft.
Real Climate (2006): 13.1 to 19.7 ft.
Mission 2010 (no date): avg. 3.1 ft.
NASA, IPCC (2007): 0.9 to 2.6 ft.
And of course that assumes that global warming is a sure thing, because lotsa scientists voted (well, stampeded) and democracy always rules in science 'cause that's how they get their grants.
At any rate, Mr. Lindorff must have a secret counsellor who is so wise that he keeps him locked away from all these other eager predictors, thus allowing him to predict more than double the rise of the wild bunch that call themselves Real Climate.
And two cat generations would only take us to about 2040, so Lindorff must be absolutely the wisest predictor of all, because at his rate of rise the ocean in 2100 (say 5.5 cat generations from now) will stand 126 feet higher than its present level. Man, he really showed them half-baked scientists! I bet he's buying Pike's Peak real estate while the rest of us waste time.
Posted by: Hank at December 27, 2007 09:21 PM (YeWPs)
15
Hell, it's not even two cat generations, Hank. He specifically says in the lifetime of his two cats. Assuming one of those cats hasn't gone off the teat yet, you get one cat generation.
This guy is giving cat owners a bad name. Bet he's got those smush-faced longhairs that piss all over his laundry and in his granola, explaining his pissy tantrums.
Posted by: Uncle Pinky at December 27, 2007 10:32 PM (5mmSd)
16
While everyone is focusing on the latest Red/Blue nasty argument, the Census Bureau state figures came out today. Hey Blue Staters: Scoreboard!
Take special note of the fact that of the 20 states registering growth above national levels, 17 are deep red
Posted by: Brad S at December 27, 2007 10:37 PM (3Z5LE)
17
Simple bait and switch
Say something totally off the wacko scale and then any modestly crazy stuff sounds sane by comparison.
Posted by: Observer at December 27, 2007 10:42 PM (1aM/I)
18
Ok, I'll leave off the slamming of another completely well-educated idiot (damn, there I go again).
Seriously, IF global warming is such a 'bad thing', why is the geologic record chalk full of information showing life - in general - prospers MORE when the planet heats up?
Next, on to physics and geophysics. As ice melts away from land, the presure of that ice due to its gravitatational force is reduced. When that happens, land rebounds (gets 'higher'). The arctic icecap does not rest on land (exposed mantle). Ice is more dense than liquid water, that's why it floats. Since the Arctic ice cap is technically floating and that ice is less dense, if it melts completely, sea levels should drop. The southern icecap is on land and the last evidence I saw shows it is growing in mass. Not area but volume. That means the Antarctic continent is getting more presure and depressing. That should raise sea levels.
Now on to climatology and the 'water cycle'. If there is more area covered by water, that means more water will be evaporated. More precipitation will be generated - snow, rain, etc. Water vapor is a much greater 'greenhouse gas' than CO2 due to its structure as a 'bent molecule'. Assuming (and this is a big assumption) atmospheric water vapor increases say...20% in the next 20 years at a nice even pace of 1%/year. More heat from the sun will be trapped in the atmosphere, more water vapor will be created, planetary real (not relative) humidity will increase at all levels of the atmosphere. Sea levels will FALL making less area available for evaporation and the planet will cool as water vapor is precipitated out.
There is NO geologic record of such a fast increase in atmospheric water vapor. Comparisons to Venus' atmosphere are nonsensical since Venus recieves approximately 2-4 times more solar energy than Terra.
This is basic logic coupled with a little science ...I know I rambled a bit...sorry. Logic tells me Anthropogenic Global Warming is bunk. My prediction if global temps rise 2 deg C in the next 20 years - sea levels will fall.
Posted by: Mark at December 28, 2007 12:13 AM (P8ylB)
19
Hey Hank,
Maybe Lindorff saw the Science Daily worst case prediction of 1.4 feet and and somehow misunderstood it as 14 meters!
Posted by: Brad at December 28, 2007 03:23 AM (skBdU)
20
Hey, I'm loving this. I live very close to the Jersey Shore, and those 14m will put me about a 15 minute stroll to the beach. House value ZOOMS!
Posted by: Mr. Bingley at December 28, 2007 09:32 AM (jii9y)
21
Brad-
That sounds about right. Was Lindorff one of the pioneers of the No Child Left Behind Act? Feeters, meters, schmeeters, what's important is getting a Big Number to throw around.
Mark-
"Ice is more dense than liquid water, that's why it floats." You may join Mr. Lindorff in the corner.
Posted by: Hank at December 28, 2007 10:27 AM (YeWPs)
22
Hank:
Whoops...that's what I get for not proof-reading enough...the "more" should have been "less"
(turns chair to corner and grumbles about fingers not doing what brain tells them too...I'll leave the corner when Hank tells me I can
Posted by: Mark at December 28, 2007 10:56 AM (4od5C)
23
Mark-
Come out! Come out! We need more wisecracks and prognostications.
Posted by: Hank at December 28, 2007 11:55 AM (YeWPs)
24
Lindorff is a Columbia educated journalist, so we should assume that a rational thought has never crossed his mind.
To bound future change, we should look back in time and realize that weather is a highly complex, stocastic system.
18,000 years ago we were in an ice age. Glaciers covered over half of the land in the Northern Hemisphere. That is a lot of ice. Sea level was 125 meters below current levels. Average temperature was 10°C.
6,000 years ago, temperatures were 3° C above present and mean sea level was only 5 meters lower than today. Glaciers had thinned and receded. Since then, they have continued to melt. Sea level has been rising steadily at an annual rate of 0.83 mm.
The thickness of a 0.9mm Pentel pencil lead is 10% more than the current average annual increase in MSL. His cats must live a long time!
Posted by: arch at December 28, 2007 01:21 PM (n5q8Q)
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Hank:
My thanks for recalling me from Coventry
The whole prolem with "melting icecaps" due to Global Warming (hmmm, I suppose I should start matching High Priest Algore's 'climate change') is that the entire system is too complex to model. The map Mr. Lindorff uses controls only one variable - sea levels. I don't know for certain if the melting arctic is being balanced by the freezing antarctic, though that does have some rather appealing asthetic yin/yang balance in my mind.
I offer the following in vein: His premise of melting = rising "will eventually be good for blue-staters" is interesting. Seems to me the Global Warming (aka: climate change) crowd claims humans are the cause of the current cycle. So, a simple syllogism seems to follow:
1) Humans cause global warming. (assume true)
2) More humans would then increase the rate of GW. (follows as true from 1)
3) Get rid of some humans to 'slow' or much more to'stop' GW.
What better way than to flood heavily populated coastlines around the world? Why not advocate for faster GW, more melting, and higher sea levels in order to drown, cause famine, and - in effect - reduce the total number of humans on the planet? After all, those nasty humans are the cause of it all...shouldn't they suffer the results?
But, then again, I think I've now beaten the dead horse a bit too much...
Posted by: Mark at December 28, 2007 01:25 PM (4od5C)
26
Arch, the sources I've checked indicate a sea level increase rate of about 3mm per year, not 0.83. Check out Wikipedia's
article on the subject.
But even at that rate, Lindorff's prediction of large areas under water "in the lifetime of my two cats" is delusional. If his cats live another 20 years, that will mean a total rise of 6cm -- less than two and a half inches. No one will even
notice that (except for scientists, who will need instruments to detect it).
Posted by: Pat Berry at December 28, 2007 03:52 PM (0suEp)
27
I'm afraid Lindorff gets just about everything about Southern California wrong too. While Santa Monica and the far left west side of L.A. might be threatened, most of the land, even around San Diego, slopes up fairly quickly from the Pacific. I'm about 15 air miles inland and over 200 ft above sea level. The Salton Sea will disappear whether or not the climate changes. It is a creation of Colorado River floods that cannot occur again unless the string of dams that now control them are destroyed. And it never was very near Palm Springs anyway.He might as well cite the hundreds of other dry lakes in the desert including Lake Manley which covered Death Valley in 650 ft of water.
Posted by: Ken Hahn at December 28, 2007 05:07 PM (uT2/F)
28
There's another point to consider... how many of these estimates assume that the rate of change will always be constant? That in itself is a logical error of the first magnitude, because in nature the rate of change itself changes all the time. Imagine if young humans grew at the same rate for their entire lives, for instance. The idea itself is ludicrous.
The same can be said for weather phenomena... does the temperature always increase at the same rate during the day? Of course not.
I haven't looked closely at those studies, so I cannot say whether or not any of them commit that logical error, but I think it's worth asking the question.
Posted by: C-C-G at December 28, 2007 09:13 PM (4tS0i)
29
This guy is a tool.
Elsewhere on his blog he claimed the Miami Herald was in Robert Wexler's district (which only extends down to mid-Broward, not into Dade where the Herald is located).
Posted by: Purple Avenger at December 29, 2007 07:15 PM (ERV3B)
30
Among all the scientific investigations and explanations I think we've missed stating the obvious: People will move.
Posted by: DoorHold at December 30, 2007 02:06 PM (yLGcU)
31
DoorHold, for a New York lefty to move into "flyover country" is surely a fate worse than death... for both the lefty and the red state whom the lefty invades.
Posted by: C-C-G at December 30, 2007 03:13 PM (ojkss)
32
Good grief! What will happen to those conservative strongholds of Seattle and the Bay Area????? I sure hope the Great Lakes don't rise, too, or else the conserative strongholds of Chicago and Detroit could also flood!!!!
Posted by: doc75 at December 30, 2007 08:09 PM (tVSYc)
33
Hmmmmm.
Ok. Let me get this straight. The worst case scenario, actual reality vs BDS, that the UN proposes that'll happen over the next 100 years is a 3cm rise in sea level. So for this liberal disaster nonsense we'll have to wait ... how long?
Posted by: memomachine at December 31, 2007 11:19 AM (3pvQO)
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Bhutto Assassinated
A supporter of Pakistan former Prime Minister Benazir Bhutto mourns deaths of his colleagues after a suicide attack in Rawalpindi, Pakistan, Thursday, Dec. 27, 2007. Bhutto died Thursday from her injuries sustained in the attack, a party aide said. At least 20 others were killed in the attack.
(AP Photo/B.K.Bangash)
Former Pakistani Prime Minster and Pakistan People's Party leader Benazir Bhutto was assassinated in Rawalpindi, Pakistan today, following a campaign rally at Liaqat Bagh park preceding elections scheduled for January 8.
Members of Bhutto's political party confirmed that Bhutto died in surgery at Rawalpindi General Hospital at 6:16 PM from gunshot wounds to her chest and neck.
At least five shots were fired at Bhutto as she entered her vehicle, and a gunman equipped with a suicide vest blew himself up 50 yards from her vehicle after the shots were fired.
Early reports indicate that at least 20 supporters and police were killed in the blast.
Bhutto led the opposition against Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf.
No group has yet claimed responsibility for the attack.
Developing news and blog coverage of the assassination is being updated at Pajamas Media.
Update: Rioting is expected across Pakistan as a result of Bhutto's death.
Bhutto had been the target of previous assassination attempts from Islamic extremists, and it would be reasonable to assume that they were behind today's attack as well. Some have been quick to also point a finger at jihadi-friendly elements of the Pakistani intelligence community, which seems a reasonable assumption, but at this time it is simply too early to know.
What is certain is that Bhutto's death will throw Pakistani into turmoil, and President Pervez Musharraf now faces the greatest crisis of his Presidency. The January 8 elections now seem in doubt, and missteps by Musharraf could plunge the nuclear-armed country into a possible civil war.
If Musharraf is able to keep the situation from deteriorating to that point, and Islamists are found to be responsible for Bhutto's assassination, he may finally be forced to face the Taliban and al Qaeda-aligned militants in the border regions that terrorists have used as a staging area and base camp since the US-led invasion of Afghanistan, forces he has largely tried to appease or ignore in the past.
Following Bhutto's assassination, it would not be very surprising to see Musharraf finally authorize U.S. forces to make cross border raids into the tribal areas in a push to wipe out known Taliban and al Qaeda strongholds, though this point, it is far too early to tell how the former general and current President will react.
Update: Via Hot Air, it seems al Qaeda is taking responsibility for the attack. This may be Musharraf's best chance to clean out the Taliban and al Qaeda with the support of the Pakistani people. Let's hope his does his nation a favor and does just that.
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So precisely which Pakistanis do you actually think support Musharraf at this moment? Bhutto's supporters will hold him responsible for this. This wasn't an ordinary suicide bombing; this was a hit. Whether AQ was responsible for the hit, Musharraf's government failed to protect her.
Posted by: bink34 at December 27, 2007 02:47 PM (nFSlR)
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My take on this is quite simply Musharraf will again have to take up the "General" mantle, declare marshal law, and kill a lot of people.
Otherwise, he's done...and so is Pakistan.
Posted by: Mark at December 27, 2007 05:23 PM (4od5C)
3
Actually, he and Pakistan may be done whether he declares martial law or not.
Posted by: C-C-G at December 27, 2007 07:43 PM (4tS0i)
4
America obviously planned this to make a quick opening for the neck of jihadi's everywhere. I am sure Mrs. Bhutto will return, satchel of money in hand to declare that she was paid by the FED to stage all this. Untill then she will be really missed, by the modern world. It's getting bad but we can't let up to stop thinking with open green mentality. GLOBAL IMPACT!
Posted by: Chrome at December 27, 2007 11:26 PM (9mEIE)
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December 26, 2007
Huck Goes a-Hunting
A fairly shrewd move, to be sure, as it highlights yet another difference between Huckabee and fellow Republican front-runner Mitt "I've been a lifelong hunter... both times" Romney.
James Oliphant wrote an amusing post on the subject, but part of it made me cringe:
Huckabee's party drew farther and farther away, circling their targets. POP! POP! Another pheasant down, the killer unknown. The journalists shivered and stomped their feet. Checking BlackBerrys is tougher with gloves on. Another hunter explained that pheasant is usually cooked with the buckshot still in the body. "You just spit it out," he said.
The party was still circling, coming back toward us. The reporters edged out to try and make out the scene. Another bird surfaced and it flew, and flew, and flew.
Right toward us.
POP! POP! POP!
We ducked our heads and scattered. "That was too close," a cameraman said. Nobody was wearing orange anything. The hunting expert said the buckshot wouldn't hurt us if it landed on our heads.
Huckabee's party drew closer and he seemed pleased at our discomfort. He produced three slain pheasants. Huckabee said he had shot one of them, but of course, there was no way to know.
It's not buckshot used in pheasant hunting, Mr. Oliphant. If it was, it would most assuredly hurt you should it happen to hit you in the head, and being roughly the size of pistol bullets, buckshot could quite possibly kill you.
More worrisome, however, is the characterization that someone in Huckabee's party shot in the direction of the press, and Huckabee seemed "pleased at our discomfort."
If that is just awkward phrasing that suggested Huckabee drew delight from firing a shotgun in the direction of the press, then perhaps Mr. Oliphant needs to be gently reminded that "words mean things."
If however, Huckabee did draw visible pleasure from someone in his party shooting close enough to the press to cause them to scatter, then his Reverend Gomer Pyle act seems to be just that... an act.
Update: It's official: Huck's entourage almost bagged some journalists:
The former Arkansas governor, who has surprised the rest of GOP field with his front-runner status here, was the first candidate to hold an event the day after Christmas. Flanked by about a dozen reporters, he wore a microphone from CNN as he went shooting, with Dude, his 3-year-old bird dog, and Chip Saltzman, his campaign manager, at his side.
In the first 30 minutes, Huckabee, Saltzman and a friend shot three birds. Their last shot flew over the heads of reporters, one whom cried out: "Oh my God! Oh my God! Don't shoot. This is traumatizing."
Oddly enough, these are the only two media mentions I've found of the near miss, even as they duly reported his crack about Vice President Cheney's hunting mishap in which he shot a fellow hunter while bird hunting.
I wonder if the media would have been so kind to other candidates in a similar situation, but then, I think we already know the answer to that.
Piling in on Huckabee's unsafe hunting trip now may deprive them of the "easy kill" they desire later in the general election.
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We all know "journalists" know next to nothing about guns or hunting. 5 seperate "journalists" could write that they were shot over and I wouldn't put any stock in it. I bet there wasn't anything out of the ordinary about the situation.
Posted by: Capitalist Infidel at December 26, 2007 08:52 PM (Lgw9b)
2
When it came time to serve his country, Sen. Mikey ran away.
Posted by: King Groundhog at December 27, 2007 01:12 AM (pktX7)
3
"This is traumatizing"?? Am I the only one who hears this shrieked in a high falsetto?
Posted by: ramona at December 27, 2007 10:15 AM (0LONs)
4
He'd better check his sites, he missed quite a few turkeys...
Posted by: Mark at December 27, 2007 05:30 PM (4od5C)
5
I find that shooting prairie chickens is not very sporting, so no harm, no fowl.
...also did I mention that they tend to be a little tough and quite "gamey?"
Posted by: everydayjoe at December 27, 2007 07:11 PM (d3xkN)
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Hmmm...
I think we've found the
poster child for Jonah Goldberg's
new book.
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Err, it's Jonah.
The honesty of that person was, I guess, refreshing in a really sick way.
Posted by: tsmonk at December 26, 2007 02:43 PM (j1orm)
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That's some quality crazy there.
Posted by: Purple Avenger at December 26, 2007 06:23 PM (ERV3B)
3
Ah, yes, the loving, caring left... always blaming someone else for their own problems.
As an admittedly minor blogger myself, I got one piece of free advice for that woman... if you can't take it, don't dish it out.
Posted by: C-C-G at December 26, 2007 08:30 PM (4tS0i)
4
The left is Authoritarian by nature
Posted by: Capitalist Infidel at December 26, 2007 08:55 PM (Lgw9b)
5
I want the 5 minutes of my life back that I wasted sifting through that nonsense.
Posted by: Conservative CBU at December 26, 2007 11:23 PM (La7YV)
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If At First You Don't Succeed...
Russia is selling a new air defense system to
our friends in Tehran:
The new S-300 air defense system signals growing miitary [sic] cooperation between Moscow and Tehran, Iranian Defense Minister Mostafa Mohammad Najjar said Wednesday.
"The S-300 air defense system will be delivered to Iran on the basis of a contract signed with Russia in the past," state television quoted Najjar as saying.
Najjar didn't say when or how many of the S-300 anti-aircraft missile defense systems would be shipped to Iran.
Earlier this year, Russia delivered 29 Tor-M1 air defense missile systems to Iran under a $700 million contract signed in December 2005.
Russian officials wouldn't comment on the Iranian statement, but the Interfax news agency quoted an unidentified source in the Russian military-industrial complex as saying that a contract for the missiles delivery had been signed several years ago and envisaged the delivery of several dozen S-300 missile systems.
The S-300 is much more powerful and versatile weapon than the Tor-M1 missile systems supplied earlier, which were capable of hitting airborne targets flying at up to 20,000 feet.
The S-300 is capable of shooting down aircraft, cruise missiles and ballistic missile warheads at ranges of up to 95 miles and at altitudes of up to 90,000 feet. Russian military officials boast that it excels the U.S.-built Patriot missiles currently being deployed in Israel.
The announcement comes three months after Israeli strike fighters bombed what some claimed was a nuclear weapons assembly plant in another Soviet client state, Syria.
The Aviation Week blog Ares suggests that the Israelis were able to penetrate the Syrian's Russian-made air defense system with non-steathy F15 and F16 strike fighters by using an airborne network attack system. The US-developed system, called "Suter," may have taken over the state-of-the-art Syrian air defense network, rendering it effectively blind.
While the capabilities of both "Suter" and the Russian air defense systems are classified, there is little reason to believe that the S-300 system is any less prone to being taken over by the airborne attack system than the TOR-1 short-range system already in use by both Syria and Iran.
If this is the case, Iran my be spending millions on an anti-aircraft system that may never see the bombers that kill it.
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December 24, 2007
Merry Christmas
1In those days Caesar Augustus issued a decree that a census should be taken of the entire Roman world. 2(This was the first census that took place while Quirinius was governor of Syria.) 3And everyone went to his own town to register.
4So Joseph also went up from the town of Nazareth in Galilee to Judea, to Bethlehem the town of David, because he belonged to the house and line of David. 5He went there to register with Mary, who was pledged to be married to him and was expecting a child. 6While they were there, the time came for the baby to be born, 7and she gave birth to her firstborn, a son. She wrapped him in cloths and placed him in a manger, because there was no room for them in the inn.
Luke 2:1-7
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Merry Christmas to you and yours!
May your Christmas be filled with food, family, fun, and much love!
Posted by: Tara at December 24, 2007 11:44 AM (Dqxeq)
Posted by: novanom at December 24, 2007 02:49 PM (clOBn)
Posted by: SlimGuy at December 24, 2007 07:29 PM (1aM/I)
4
Merry Christmas to you, Bob, and everyone here.
Posted by: Dusty at December 25, 2007 11:04 AM (GJLeQ)
5
The blessings of the Savior's birth to everyone here. Or, as a famous character put it, "God bless us, every one."
Posted by: C-C-G at December 25, 2007 11:11 AM (4tS0i)
6
Merry Christmas, one and all!
Posted by: Mark at December 25, 2007 11:38 PM (P8ylB)
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December 21, 2007
Thompson Responds to Roger Simon's Hit-Piece in The Politico
With humor: "
Just remember...we don't raise our hands when we're told to, and we don't wear any hats, unless they're our own."
Thompson's dig is funny; the response from The Politico thus far is not.
Despite attempts to reach them via both the media and editorial email addresses on their site, The Politico seems to be going the route of The New Republic, and seems intent on trying a strategy of stonewalling. Perhaps they are hoping that the story of Simon's doctored quote will simply go away.
I was hoping that as an ostensibly "new media" organization they would address controversy with transparency, but that does not seem to be the case.
Old habits apparently die hard.
Update: Now on Youtube.
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Bob, how DARE you question them? If they tell you it's Shinola, then that settles it!
Posted by: Mike G in Corvallis at December 21, 2007 01:18 PM (qmdN5)
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Hey Mike! Fancy seeing you here.
FRED IS THE MAN!!!
Posted by: Gullyborg at December 21, 2007 01:21 PM (Vy/A9)
3
Nice, I just added it to my Politico post.
Posted by: doubleplusundead at December 21, 2007 01:29 PM (P17op)
4
Gee, color me surprised, an opinion site with pretensions of being part of the MSM turn out to be your regular crapweasels.
Posted by: David at December 21, 2007 01:49 PM (x25n0)
5
Color me surprised, an opinion site with pretensions of being part of the MSM turn out to be your regular crapweasels.
Posted by: David at December 21, 2007 01:53 PM (x25n0)
Posted by: TC@LeatherPenguin at December 21, 2007 04:42 PM (FngTJ)
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OOPS!
Roger thought he was so slick he didn't think he would get caught.
Spread the other research around because most folks are apparently supporting liberals who shouldn't be running on a republican ticket;
http://candidateresearch.blogspot.com/
Posted by: Winghunter at December 21, 2007 05:59 PM (2vp3x)
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I mean this not as a criticism, but as a sincere question:
What exactly was it about the "misquote" of Thompson that was unfair?
It's not unusual to truncate quotes like that. It is of course objectionable if the omitted phrase changes the meaning. But how was that the case here?
As quoted: "I've got a silly hat rule."
As said: "I've got a silly hat rule that I'm about to violate." Which rule Thompson did NOT, then, go on to violate.
In other words, he was offered the helmet, and didn't put it on, citing the "silly hat rule." Just like the Politico article said.
Posted by: JC at December 22, 2007 01:30 AM (Q/itq)
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Fred's stock just skyrocketed as far as I'm concerned. This incident is just the latest Fred has handled with grace and style. Here's a candidate who really understands the new media environment -- and has a sense of humor.
Posted by: Laika's Last Woof at December 22, 2007 01:45 AM (9ruXO)
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Wasn't Bob Simon a big name on the NPR circuit?
Posted by: davod at December 22, 2007 04:34 AM (llh3A)
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JC,
Simon was implying that Fred was sour and borderline insulting, completely missing the good natured banter that occurred, which the truncated quote tends to show. As do the video and pictures of the smiling faces.
Simon also states in his very first sentence that Fred never got off the bus, which is false.
Though Simon says it was "no big deal" he wasn't allowed to sit in on the interview with the local editor, he seems like he's pouting about it like a widdle girl. Man up, Simon.
Fred isn't lazy. Not finishing a quote--that's lazy.
Posted by: Noel at December 22, 2007 07:01 AM (0eKTE)
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I like your Fred Thompson's steadfastness. It is a realistic approach that is sorely lacking in this country today. Some call it old school. I call it the Fred Thompson reality check. Whats the new creedo 'man up' ha thats a good one. It must be a girl thing!
Posted by: vince spataro at December 22, 2007 09:59 AM (Cwho3)
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Yes y'all the MSM has a impossible time with truth, but they are great on lies, slander, innuendo, short lines etc., but it rarely bothers FRED, he walks so tall among the slobs and ignores most all the junk!
A good man, a real man, and the leader of America in 2008--Join me voters --Fred's tops with class, toughness, brains and manners too!!!
Posted by: jftous at December 23, 2007 01:45 AM (pn7ik)
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just for the record - a fireman's hat IS a silly hat. c'mon, do you ever see anyone over the age of 12 wearing one out in public? i bet if you count hats at your local mall you'll see more guys in berets than in firefighter hats! not even firefighters wear it unless they are fighting a fire. and then they wear it because of its functionality, not because its cool.
Posted by: chas at December 24, 2007 12:58 AM (6a+Fd)
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I'm fairly new at this blog thing and would like to know what does URL stand for?Fred sounds like he is the man for the job. The more I hear what he stands for the more I like him.He sounds like he is a man of his word.
Posted by: Gary at December 25, 2007 09:24 AM (BZHuI)
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Gary, URL is short for Uniform Resource Locator... or some people would say Universal for the "U" (you say po-tay-to, I say po-tah-to...). Basically, that's the technical term for a web address. For instance, www.confederateyankee.mu.nu is a URL.
I could go on, but that's enough geekiness for one Christmas morning.
Posted by: C-C-G at December 25, 2007 11:09 AM (4tS0i)
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Mr. Rogers Runs For President
I'm glad to see Mike Huckabee is focusing on
the pressing issues.
"It's a tragedy when a sixteen year old who is not really prepared for all the responsibilities of adult life is gonna now be faced with responsibilities of honest to goodness adult life," said Iowa GOP frontrunner, former Arkansas Governor and Baptist minister Mike Huckabee.
He was talking about Britney Spears' younger pregnant sister Jamie Lynn.
"I respect that apparently she's going have the child," Huckabee continued, per ABC News' Kevin Chupka. "I think that's the right decision, a good decision and I respect that and appreciate that. I hope its not an encouragement to other 16 year olds to think that that's the best course of action."
I only wish he were as interested in foreign policy...
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Yeah,
someone else made a similar point yesterday, this is the same guy who had no friggin' clue about the Iran NIE, yet boy he had plenty of things to say about a knocked up teen pop star.
Posted by: doubleplusundead at December 21, 2007 01:13 PM (P17op)
2
"I respect that apparently she's going have the child ... I hope its not an encouragement to other 16 year olds to think that that's the best course of action."
Think, Mike, before you open your mouth, not after.
Posted by: Bill Faith at December 21, 2007 08:08 PM (m7uoV)
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Bill, I am no Huckabee supporter (as a quick look at my blog will reveal), but as far as the "going to have the child" comment, it seems to me that he was contrasting having the child with aborting it.
Posted by: C-C-G at December 21, 2007 08:24 PM (4tS0i)
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In all fairness, didn't we rag on Dan Quayle some time ago for criticizing Murphy Brown's unwed pregnancy? He was mocked and belittled for focusing on "trivial entertainment."
And shortly afterward, wasn't even the MSM printing the headline, "Dan Quayle Was Right?"
Extramarital sex, teen pregnancy and unwed motherhood ARE, begging your pardon, major issues in this nation, and getting bigger all the time--- the burden it places on our country's welfare system, crime rates, and more are long documented. And I don't think the attention or concern is misplaced, when Hollywood celebrities are out there getting knocked up and
flaunting it before a watching world full of celebrity-worshipping teenagers.
Posted by: RHJunior at December 21, 2007 09:30 PM (Ul/is)
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December 20, 2007
Roger Simon's Hit-Job On Fred Thompson At The Politico
I thought I'd said all I was going to say about Roger Simon's article in
The Politico yesterday afternoon in the comments at
Hot Air, but as more comes out about the article, I think it is worthy of a dedicated post.
Simon (not the Roger L.Simon of Pajamas Media with whom I interviewed Fred Thompson in November) put up a post called Fred Thompson: Lazy as charged (bad link earlier, now fixed -ed).
The article was damning—brutal, even—and highlighted what appeared to be a huge gaffe in his bus tour through Waverly, Iowa:
...Thompson rode four blocks to the local fire station. Local fire stations always have captive audiences (unless there is a fire).
Inside, Thompson shook a few hands — there were only about 15 people there — and then Chief Dan McKenzie handed Thompson the chief's fire hat so Thompson could put it on.
Thompson looked at it with a sour expression on his face.
"I've got a silly hat rule," Thompson said.
In point of fact, the "silly" hat was the one Chief McKenzie wore to fires and I am guessing none of the firefighters in attendance considered it particularly silly, but Thompson was not going to put it on. He just stood there holding it and staring at it.
To save the moment, Jeri Thompson took the hat from her husbandÂ’s hands and put it on her head.
"You look cute," Thompson said to her. She did.
Within the context of the rest of the article, Simon's snide editorial reference to the firemen being a "captive audience" would almost go unnoticed.
His description of what happened next, however, used an unambiguously doctored quote. We know this because the events were captured in a video shown at CBS News (click image to watch):
Simon quoted Thompson as stating that "I've got a silly hat rule."
As the CBS video clearly showed, that was only part of Thompson's statement.
What Thompson actually said was, "I've got a silly hat rule that I'm about to violate."
Thompson then takes the Chief's helmet and starts to raise it if he is going to put it on, and then says, while laughing, "I ain't gonna do it... I ain't gonna do it."
At this point Jeri Thompson steps in and Fred puts the helmet on her. Throughout the video, you can hear those assembled laughing, including Chief Dan McKenzie, who handed Thompson the helmet to begin with. McKenzie is shown smiling widely at the end of the clip.
We don't know if the entire Politico article is grossly unfair in the way it characterized Senator Thompson's swing through Waverly, Iowa, but we do know, thanks to the CBS News video, that not only was Simon's editorializing of what occurred in the Waverly Fire Department mischaracterized, but that he doctored a quote to make his article appear all the more damning.
Simon is the Chief Political Columnist for The Politico—one that they tout as one of "Washington's most visible and experienced journalists."— and should know, beyond the shadow of a doubt, that doctoring quotes is highly unethical by any journalistic standard.
In their mission statement, The Politico brags about those journalist they would empower:
Today, many of the reporters having the most impact are those whose work carries a unique signature, who add a distinct voice to the public conversation. Their work, in other words, matters more than where they work.
Reporters stand out from the crowd in a number of ways. Some regularly break news before their competitors. Some have a gift for interpretation, for connecting the dots in illuminating ways. Still others stand out through their eloquence and original storytelling.
Politico will promote and celebrate journalists who have a unique signature. That's why we've been able to attract reporters and editors who have worked at such places as Time magazine and The New York Times, National Public Radio, Roll Call and The Hill, Bloomberg News Service, the Philadelphia Inquirer, USA Today and The Washington Post.
There is a difference, however, between voice and advocacy. That's one traditional journalism ideal we fully embrace. There is more need than ever for reporting that presents the news fairly, not through an ideological prism. One of the most distressing features of public life recently has been the demise of shared facts. Warring partisans -- many of whom take their news from sources that cater to and amplify their existing opinions -- live in separate zones of reality. In such a climate, every news story is viewed as either weapon or shield in a nonstop ideological war. Our answer to this will be journalism that insists on the primacy of facts over ideology.
Though a doctored quote and a misrepresentation of events captured on camera, Roger Simon seems to have violated that difference between voice and advocacy that The Politico claims to represent.
It remains to be seen if the senior editorial staff of The Politico will take this clear evidence of journalistic malpractice seriously.
Update: I just sent the following to The Politico via their contact form:
Roger Simon's "Fred Thompson: Lazy as charged" included a doctored quote.
Simon states:
"'I've got a silly hat rule,' Thompson said."
That is factually incorrect.
What Thompson said is "I've got a silly hat rule that I'm about to violate."
Simon left off the entire second half of the quote, which was captured, in full, in the CBS News video that captured the event.
You owe it it your readers to correct the record in Simon's story.
I would ask you further what remedy you feel is worthy for a reporter that doctors quotes.
Thank you.
I've also left voicemail for Chief Dan McKenzie at the Waverly, Iowa Fire Department, asking for his view of what occurred yesterday.
I'd be very interested in seeing what both The Politico and Chief McKenzie have to say, and hope they take the time to respond.
Update: Over at A Second Hand Conjecture, Michael W. notes that this is not the first time that Roger Simon of The Politico may have been caught using partial or non-existent quotes.
If this is indeed the case, it seems a resignation, and not a retraction, is in order from Mr. Simon.
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There is no way to defend this. It's as clear as can be. Whatever Simon's motivations, he has proved himself to be unethical.
And it wasn't just cutting off teh end o the quote. He completely mischaracterized the gathering. Forget Fred - you think a fireman would be unhappy to be next to that pretty babe? And she DID look cute as hell in the hat. Yummy.
Maybe Roger is jealous of Fred?
Anyways...another lie revealed. Thank you.
Posted by: sts at December 20, 2007 12:42 PM (vlZE0)
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Roger Simon wrote a book about the 2000 election in which he confused Orrin Hatch and Arlen Specter. Anyone who can't tell a Jewish liberal from PA from a Mormon conservative from UT has no business covering politics.
Is the Politico in the business of hiring deceitful morons?
Guess so.
Posted by: Anne Deupree at December 20, 2007 12:58 PM (UvFne)
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The worst thing about this whole episode, for me, was the credulity it was treated with over at HotAir. That and when people disputed the account, AP accused Fred's supporters of being a step away from Paulbots.
Posted by: TBinSTL at December 20, 2007 01:39 PM (soc2D)
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Notice that Simon interprets "silly" to modify "hat", when it actually refers to "rule", as in "hat rule", a rule about hats. Thompson has a silly rule about hats. By cutting off the second half of the quote, Simon makes it more difficult to imagine that Thompson might have meant something other than what Simon says. Ahem. When you actually listen to Thompson, it's obvious that he's referring to the rule, rather than the hat. The rule is the focus of the sentence, as you can see from the dependent clause, "which I'm about to violate." Simon is a biased incompetent.
Posted by: clazy at December 20, 2007 01:57 PM (EWsFM)
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I wouldn't be too hard on the guys over at
Hot Air and Michelle. They did post an update, and we all get a little hot-headed from time to time, myself included.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at December 20, 2007 01:58 PM (vxbTC)
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So is CBS's John Bentley. Or maybe both are simply deaf.
Posted by: clazy at December 20, 2007 01:58 PM (EWsFM)
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One of the quote doctors over at TNR (where else) just adored Simon's story.
I don't remember which of their phony journalists it was -- not Fabricating Frank Foer, because I'd remember if it was his byline. One of the others... Ruth Shalit?
Posted by: Kevin R.C. O'Brien at December 20, 2007 02:16 PM (IDmXv)
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Another editorial statement (thinly disguised as fact) in Simon's Politico article on Fred Thompson, is that Fred did not walk down the mainstreet of Waverly, even though it is a main street kind of town. The implication by Simon is that Fred should have, and that the explanation by the campaign, citing concern for winter weather (ice/snow) is implausible. Two questions occur: 1.) is Waverly, in fact, a "main street" kind of town?; 2.) what is implausible about a concern for slipping on ice in December in Iowa, particularly when Weather.com shows a high in the 20's for most of this week, and a major snow storm went through that region last week?
(Note that Hillary's campaign is traveling by helicopter across Iowa, according to a chicago tribune article I cannot link to due to the comments engine)
The Hillary article mentions the snow storm that hit Eastern Iowa, and a search on google map reveals that Waverly is, in fact, in Eastern Iowa.
Posted by: mjh at December 20, 2007 02:17 PM (nwkAN)
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Sounds to me like The Politico hires has-been liberal journalists that (Fox) RINO News Network sets out to pasture.
This is not journalism. It is fiction. And should rightly be labeled as such. It looks like there is coming a time when the MSM is going to have to start putting ratings on their stories like Hollywood productions.
Posted by: Gomez at December 20, 2007 02:44 PM (n+Fxi)
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Read the original piece. Thompson's people refused to allow Simon to sit in on Fred's meeting with the local newspaper editor, and Simon was peeved about it.
He decided to show them a thing or two . . . "Never pick a fight with a fellow who buys ink by the barrel," the old saying went. Update to " . . . who buys bandwidth by the terabyte."
I mean, how picky is it to criticize Thompson for not walking down Main Street? Simon claimed there were shoppers in one of the stores he could have greeted . . . the whole piece is a hit job. Extremely unprofessional.
Posted by: Jim Addison at December 20, 2007 02:46 PM (uqc7t)
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Simon does what all liberals do, he lies.
Posted by: Capitalist Infidel at December 20, 2007 03:11 PM (Lgw9b)
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Politico is internet warmed over MSM. Jonathon Martin's snide coverage of the Republicans tends to raise the bile. Frankly, the Beltway crowd is all the same, no matter how they distribute their hits.
Posted by: Jake at December 20, 2007 03:42 PM (/RueP)
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I have found politico to be suspect ever since they co hosted the first ridiculous debate for the Reps in the summer.
On that note, I don't think that the Politico has much sway in the Republican primary and thus I don't know how much effect this article will have. Whenever media like this try something like this it almost always hurts them more than the person they are trying to hurt themselves.
I think the Politico's reputation will take a much bigger hit than the Thompson campaign.
I will point out that Thompson is by no means the only Rep to be the subject of a hit piece.
Here is my analysis of a hit piece on Rudy...
http://proprietornation.blogspot.com/2007/10/hatchet-job-masquerading-as-political.html
Posted by: Mike Volpe at December 20, 2007 04:04 PM (86F5q)
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I have found Politico to be suspect ever since they cohosted the ridiculous debate with MSNBC in the summer. I would add that I doubt they have much sway among the Republican primary voting electorate and frankly blogs like yours have more sway and as soon as your piece and others like it make their way around the right blogosphere, it will wind up hitting politico back and gain some sympathy for Thompson.
I think that the media hurts themselves a lot more than their intended target when they try nonsense like this.
I would also point out that Thompson is not the only Republican to have a hit piece directed at them. I think most have. Here is my analysis of a hit piece on Rudy...
http://proprietornation.blogspot.com/2007/10/hatchet-job-masquerading-as-political.html
Posted by: Mike Volpe at December 20, 2007 04:08 PM (86F5q)
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The article is a biased hit-job even without the doctored quote.
Simon expects all politicians to conform to his and his colleagues' (extremely tired old) standards for how granular, local, "retail" politics ought to be done, and is done, in Iowa. We've all been reading the same damn stories about Candidate X eating the damned corned dog or Candidate Y kissing the baby for at least the last six elections, haven't we?
That's their narrative.
To use a phrase that Fred's also recently used in Iowa, reporters like Simon want the candidates to "behave" (i.e., comply) like "trained monkeys, performing on command" -- and that includes giving (self-)important reporters like Simon practically unlimited access to the candidates everywhere they go.
Comes now Fred Dalton Thompson, a dignified and serious man who (politely, jokingly, and very wisely) refuses to wear the damned fireman's hat himself; who doesn't see fit to include big internet reporter Simon in his face-to-face meeting with a local newspaper editor; and who perhaps has other priorities right now than walking up and down snowy streets of a tiny town trying to find a small handful of locals who might possibly have a baby he can kiss, or a corned dog, or whatever.
Confronted with such "non-cooperation," then it's out with the truth, and on with the narrative ("Fred's lazy, it's true, I saw it with my own eyes, and who are you going to believe, me or that lying videotape?")
Fred has a spine. He won't pander. That puzzles and even confuses some people, but I think voters will ultimately recognize that it makes him a better candidate to actually
be president (even if he's not the press corps' ideal campaigner).
Posted by: Beldar at December 20, 2007 04:22 PM (kLHPS)
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Thompson won his 1994 Senate run by defying the "conventional wisdom" about how campaigns should be run.
Seems he is doing the same thing here, and, as Beldar points out, the MSM is peeved about it.
It will be interesting to see how the people that really matter--that is, the voters, not the talking heads--view Thompson's approach.
Posted by: C-C-G at December 20, 2007 07:38 PM (4tS0i)
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That type of article fits well with a topic of discussion I listened to while driving home. The topic was the possibility of filing suit for journalistic malpractice, which, I think, would make for an interesting court battle.
Posted by: Boss429 at December 20, 2007 08:11 PM (Q1yM9)
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Bob, I don't always agree with you, but wow do I love it when you get hold of something that piques your ire.
Posted by: Tony B at December 20, 2007 10:06 PM (187Jq)
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Maybe the chief was handing Fred a new helment. I wouldn't want anyone trying on my helment since it's been in a few fires and crashed vehicles. No telling what kind of contamination is on/in it. We wipe them down with a bleach water solution before letting anyone handle them. Oh, I forgot. Simon is simply a lying and biased ahole.
Posted by: Scrapiron at December 20, 2007 11:20 PM (d/RyS)
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You're a firefighter, Scrapiron? May I go off-topic and thank you for being one of those that runs into danger when everyone else runs out?
Posted by: C-C-G at December 20, 2007 11:27 PM (4tS0i)
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To critique clazy's critique:
The amputated quote does the job of indicting the author of the article well enough without grasping for straws by trying to analyze which word was being modified by "silly."
Silly hats in political campaigns go back a long, long way--one of the most famous is Calvin Coolidge in the Indian chief's headdress. Think also of Dukakis in the tank commander's helmet. These gaffes have been discussed again and again over the decades, and there's no doubt that Thompson actually meant a "silly hat" rule. There's also no doubt that the phrase is simply shorthand for "unusual headgear worn with the object of endearing oneself with a targeted voter bloc," rather than an attack on firefighters and their helmets.
Posted by: novanom at December 21, 2007 09:23 AM (sLvR2)
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Who cares whether he said he was about to violate the rule or not? He didn't, in fact violate it. The point of this stupid anecdote is that Thompson didn't want to wear the hat because he has a rule against wearing hats that might make him look foolish in a shot. Why does it matter that he briefly indicated he would wear it but then changed his mind?
Posted by: Attack Monster at December 21, 2007 03:22 PM (kCcME)
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Reminds me of when the media continually said that Al Gore claimed he'd "invented" the Internet.
Posted by: DLS at December 21, 2007 04:18 PM (Gxawq)
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Um, the omitted second half the quotation doesn't alter or otherwise modify the first half so as to change the meaning or context of his comment.
Aka, including the omission would not have salvaged the "gaffe."
Aka, all this hot air is over nothing.
Posted by: Nathan at December 21, 2007 04:26 PM (MM+8E)
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I ran into Roger Simon way back when reporting on nuclear waste at Yucca Mountain. He wanted to hear ABSOLUTELY only one side of the story. It was a real shocker to meet a journalist who not only had a slant, but refused to hear the opposite side.
Posted by: stuart at December 21, 2007 06:42 PM (DoFVu)
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Attack Monster, it matters because, among other things, it puts a whole different spin on the event and makes a joke sound like an ill-tempered remark.
Posted by: Gina at December 21, 2007 06:50 PM (BUGEf)
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I'll be durned... I am actually finding myself in agreement with Novanom.
Parsing the sentence is secondary, what should be of primary importance to this story is the fact that the sentence was cut off and thus taken out of context--very much out of context, in fact.
Posted by: C-C-G at December 21, 2007 08:29 PM (4tS0i)
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I also tried to submit comments and contact Simon and the Politico regarding this story. The Waverly Democrat also offers a much different description of the events.
Posted by: Matt Moran at December 21, 2007 09:32 PM (x+/7i)
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The only thing new media has to differentiate itself is its credibility. Lacking that, the MSM has superior distribution, marketing, production, news-gathering, newsfeeds, etc.
The Politico has to decide if it's going to engineer an early death or not on whether it terminates this fraud and sets a clear standard for credible, ethical reporting. Lacking Simon's termination, there's no reason to read yet another tired Firedoglake-inspired liberal opinion blog.
Posted by: redherkey at December 21, 2007 10:39 PM (kjqFg)
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Simon got it right. There is no dispute that Thompson admitted he has a silly hat rule. That it was followed by "that I am about to violate" makes absolutely no difference. Thompson didn't have the courage or courtesy to put the hat on. And, being the weakling that he is, he left it to his wife to bail him out. Just as Bill relies on Hillary.
Thompson knows he blundered. That's why he referred to the incident in his request for more money filmed on his bus in Iowa by saying "We don't raise our hands when we're told to and we don't wear hats that aren't our own." before putting on a cowboy hat that made him look like a drugstore cowboy.
There are three things that are totally overrated: Young women (That's the polite version.), imported beer and Fred Thompson.
Posted by: Richard Graham at December 22, 2007 09:52 AM (AiJXe)
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Richard, can I borrow you for a few days? I need to drill some holes, and you spin well enough to be an excellent drill.
Posted by: C-C-G at December 22, 2007 10:34 AM (4tS0i)
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I'm as big an opponent of liberal media bias as you'll find, but I don't see the problem here with Simon's report. Simon quotes the "silly hat rule," but ignores that Thompson also (1) first said that he was about to violate it, and then (2) changed his mind and said he would adhere to the rule. Simon is exactly right in the substance here, because (1) and (2) cancel out. Would it have been more accurate to say that he initially said that he would violate the rule and then changed his mind? I guess, but it would have taken additional space, and would have added zero content to what Simon actually said about the episode. Right?
Best regards,
CThomas
Posted by: CThomas at December 22, 2007 11:55 AM (8t6dj)
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C-C-G: The problem with the blogosphere is people such as yourself who mouth off without backing their mouths up with logic. So, we'll give you a chance to prove yourself.
State intelligently and cogently why my observations are wrong.
And remember, no smart-mouthing-just logic.
"I used to be disgusted, now I'm just amused." Anonymous although it may have been Elvis Costello.
Posted by: Richard Graham at December 22, 2007 01:03 PM (MI8jb)
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Simple, Richard... Thompson
did start to put the hat on, as reported above.
Therefore, at the time he uttered it, he intended to break the rule he had just mentioned. I call your attention to the statement "Thompson then takes the Chief's helmet and starts to raise it if he is going to put it on," which appears above in the main article. Therefore, the statement is germane and should have been included.
That he later changed his mind has no bearing on his frame of mind at the time he uttered the statement... he is not prescient, he could not have known he'd change his mind at a later time.
Therefore, logically, the full quote should have been included.
Please do not take my sharp tongue (fingers?) as evidence that I lack a similarly sharp brain. Quite the opposite, my sharp brain empowers my sharp tongue (or fingers, as the case may be).
Good day, sir.
Posted by: C-C-G at December 22, 2007 03:12 PM (4tS0i)
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Got an error first time, if this is a double post, I apologize.
Simple, Richard... Thompson
did start to put the hat on, as reported above.
Therefore, at the time he uttered it, he intended to break the rule he had just mentioned. I call your attention to the statement "Thompson then takes the Chief's helmet and starts to raise it if he is going to put it on," which appears above in the main article. Therefore, the statement is germane and should have been included.
That he later changed his mind has no bearing on his frame of mind at the time he uttered the statement... he is not prescient, he could not have known he'd change his mind at a later time.
Therefore, logically, the full quote should have been included.
Please do not take my sharp tongue (fingers?) as evidence that I lack a similarly sharp brain. Quite the opposite, my sharp brain empowers my sharp tongue (or fingers, as the case may be).
Good day, sir.
Posted by: C-C-G at December 22, 2007 03:15 PM (4tS0i)
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Richard, C-C-G can't state why your observations were wrong because you didn't make any observations; you just offered a bunch of bitchy value judgments and meaningless insults. If someone that you approve of had done exactly the same thing as Thompson did, then your value judgments would have been exactly the opposite. It would have been courageous _not_ to put the hat on. Instead of his wife's actions showing him for a weakling, it would have shown him for being strong enough to rely on his wife. Instead of the cowboy hat making him look like a drugstore cowboy, it would have made him look like a movie-hero cowboy.
If you don't want bitchy responses, you should stop making such a bitchy comments.
Posted by: Doc Rampage at December 22, 2007 05:46 PM (yIpmv)
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Remember Michael Dukakis' tank ride while wearing headgear? Remember how silly he looked? Apparently, Fred Thompson remembers too.
Posted by: Sandman at December 22, 2007 06:02 PM (1eTf8)
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"That he later changed his mind has no bearing on his frame of mind at the time he uttered the statement... he is not prescient, he could not have known he'd change his mind at a later time."
Right. He fully intended to, but two seconds later he discovered that the intention had gone away. Happens all the time. Disgraceful that Simon denied him credit for those two seconds of sincerity.
You *do* have a sharp brain, CCG!
Posted by: SqueakyRat at December 23, 2007 05:47 AM (w2PI5)
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C-C-G and Doc Rampage: The news quote was accurate because it reflected what happened. Thompson was too cowardly to put the hat on and he let his wife bail him out. Thompson should have put the hat on and been done with it. It's that simple. Now, we have another example of a candidate's supporters blaming the candidate's cowardice and stupidity on the media. That's why Thompson is a loser.
You are both fortunate to live in a country in which people such as yourselves are allowed to post opinions that sound as if they are 15 year girls having their first menstrual cycle. (I am guessing, perhaps wrongly, that you are both "male.".) You are both classic examples of what Rush Limbaugh calls the "chickification" of America.
Posted by: Richard Graham at December 23, 2007 07:43 AM (AiJXe)
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Ya know, Richard, it seems rather crude of you to resort to insults after asking me for "no smart-mouthing."
Methinks thou dost protest too much.
Posted by: C-C-G at December 23, 2007 10:39 AM (4tS0i)
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Perhaps he didn't put it on because he won't wear hats which he is not entitled to wear.
Posted by: Dave at December 23, 2007 10:44 AM (mVD0i)
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Why is there so much angst and virtual ink spilled over the inoccuous phrase "captive audience"? It implies absolutely nothing other than the fact that a politician spoke to on-duty fire fighters who were not at liberty to leave the fire hall. It's not derogatory, factually incorrect, nor misleading. It "would almost go unnoticed" because it is scarcely worth noticing.
Really, is this what following and debating campaigns is all about? Restaurant tips? Silly parsing rules, and endless high dudgeon?
It seems the MSM is not the only bastion of hypersensitive delight in the trivial.
Posted by: Pazuzu's Petals at December 23, 2007 10:55 AM (HPHFp)
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Speaking of hypersensitive delight in the trivial, Pazuzu, where is the "angst" and "virtual ink" about that phrase? CY mentioned it twice, but you're the very first commenter to do so, after more than 40 comments.
Pot, meet kettle.
Posted by: C-C-G at December 23, 2007 11:16 AM (4tS0i)
44
C-C-G;
I stand corrected. No commenter did mention it; just the author. I should have referrred to the ink spilled about the article in its entirety, not just that phrase.
My argument about the phrase stands - it's inoccuous.
As for the 'pot/kettle' trivial charge, CY put the phrase into play for discussion, and thus invited debate. So 'sloppy writing' - not 'trivial' - is the only accusation I'll accept from you.
Posted by: Pazuzu's Petals at December 25, 2007 03:43 PM (HPHFp)
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You completely misunderstood my argument, Pazuzu. The phrase "pot, meet kettle" referred to your own "angst" and "virtual ink spilled" over that statement, while you decry CY's.
To make it even simpler, while you are busily denouncing CY for his "angst" and so on, you are demonstrating your own "angst." Thereby proving that you are just as guilty of the errors you blame CY for.
Ergo, you are a pot, calling a kettle black.
Ain't logic wonderful?
Posted by: C-C-G at December 25, 2007 08:19 PM (4tS0i)
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Richard Graham:
"The news quote was accurate because it reflected what happened. Thompson was too cowardly to put the hat on and he let his wife bail him out. Thompson should have put the hat on and been done with it. It's that simple. Now, we have another example of a candidate's supporters blaming the candidate's cowardice and stupidity on the media. That's why Thompson is a loser."
Replace the negative adjectives with positive ones and the comment would have the same value - zero. As was noted above, your post has nothing to object to because it IS nothing but a series of value judgments that have no objective backing. And using your logic, it's a catch-22 - Thompson's silly if he puts the hat on and cowardly if he doesn't. What kind of objectivity is THAT?
How do we determine that this misquote is more than just leaving out two seconds? Well, maybe it's because Roger Simon gets so much else wrong here. Example: Thompson's expression is not sour as Simon describes, it's half-laughing. Example: Later in the article, Simon refers to a Waverly Democrat reporter who calls Thompson's response to her question about farming "glittering generalities" (HER question was vague, and he said he would try to reduce subsidies on farming and support funding for soil/land conservation programs).
Thus we can see that Simon goes beyond simple bias to dishonesty.
By the way, your complaint about "smart-mouthing" seems misplaced given that you're busy calling the candidate a coward and a weakling, and given that unlike many smart-mouthers, these two didn't use theirs to cover for a lack of logic. What is generally objectionable about foul language is that it's used IN PLACE OF logic - Doc Rampage at least used the language to COMPLEMENT his logic.
Posted by: Math_Mage at December 25, 2007 10:45 PM (1NhoY)
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At PJM...
Lethal Weapon: Could Romney's Gun Position Kill His Campaign?
When a Presidential candidate doesn't understand the Constitution and Bill of Rights, it's time to look elsewhere (and I'm looking at you, too, Rudy and McCain-Feingold).
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
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I really find Mitt's gun position (and Rudy's) untenable and each a Vote-killer, especially given the revealing comments at PJM -- that he did NOT bring pro- and anti-gun lobbies together, who and whatever he brought together was astroturf -- and the bill severely curtailed MA residents' 2nd Amendment rights.
We have enough problems starting again here in CA, now that Stupid-Arnold signed the deceitful and Impossible Microstamping Bill and the un-scientific fakery of the Lead Ammo Ban (if it saves just one Condor...), which anti-gun lobby will try and push everywhere else. Get ready for it coming to your state soon.
Posted by: DirtCrashr at December 20, 2007 12:23 PM (VNM5w)
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Not a part of the R party, nor D one, either... but I have looked a bit at the R field (the D is a complete loss in my estimation) and now must ask:
where has the Republican party gotten to?
I assume it got taken hostage back in the mid-90s, and am amazed that no one has put out milk cartons with the 'Have you seen me?' on the side. Really! What is up with the party of Lincoln, T. Roosevelt and Reagan? Because if 'conservatives' can't remember their own history, then they really aren't being 'conservative'.... Milk cartons are called for as well as 15 second ads:
Missing Political Party... ok... Two Missing Political Parties, to be fair about it...
Posted by: ajacksonian at December 20, 2007 01:21 PM (oy1lQ)
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R is just a description of how I vote on occasion, I'd just as soon vote for Obama if it ties the Senate and Congress into knots and prevents any further action for another four years until we can get a real Conservative in office.
Posted by: DirtCrashr at December 20, 2007 01:50 PM (VNM5w)
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December 19, 2007
Time's Submission of The Year
Time Magazine has declared Russian strongman
Vladimir Putin as their 2007
Person of the Year. It should come as little surprise. Time's award has become increasingly irrelevant over the years, and I say that as a
past winner who was equally deserving of the award.
Time selected a man that lorded over a Russian security service that apparently murdered a former intelligence officer Alexander Litvinenko in London and refused to extradite his accused murderer, Andrei Lugovoi, which led to the expulsion of four Russian envoys by the British government in protest. That Putin obliquely compared the United States to Nazi Germany earleir this year also probably scored Putin points among Time's editors.
The fact that Putin's critics in the Russian media tend to wind up dead somehow escaped their glowing review—or perhaps inspired it.
17 Russian journalists have been killed since Putin came to power, 14 of which are described as contract murders. None of the 14 murders have ever been solved, including the murders of three journalists—Marina Pisareva, Konstantin Brovko, and Ivan Safronov—in 2007.
Perhaps Time selected their Person of the Year for 2007 not for political or editorial reasons, but for that most basic human desire... survival.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
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Posted by: Mekan at December 19, 2007 10:52 AM (hm8tW)
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I suspect that at some time in the future(no pun intended), the editorial kneepads at Time will be bronzed and put on display in the Kremlin.
Posted by: Conservative CBU at December 19, 2007 11:48 AM (La7YV)
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Communist sympathizers honoring a brutal Communist...who would of thunk it?
Posted by: Capitalist Infidel at December 19, 2007 12:13 PM (Lgw9b)
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They long for the Old Days of the big and powerful USSR, cold-war spy games, and the Berlin Wall... Sheesh.
Posted by: DirtCrashr at December 19, 2007 01:47 PM (VNM5w)
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Time magazine Communist sympathizers? Really?
The same Time magazine that exists on corporate advertising money? Communists?
The same Time magazine that made George W. Bush Man of the Year not once, but
twice? Communists?
Call them irrelevant, as I do, but Communist sympathizers? Hardly.
Posted by: David Terrenoire at December 19, 2007 02:16 PM (LUDhw)
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The same magazine that made Gorbachov, and not Reagan, the man of the 80's? Yeah. THOSE Communist sympathizers.
Posted by: tsmonk at December 19, 2007 03:42 PM (j1orm)
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You're aware that they don't necessarily give the award for a person's
goodness, right?
Posted by: novanom at December 19, 2007 04:03 PM (22/Qe)
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The criteria for selection are the person who most affects the news of the year, good or bad.
But
Putin?
Sure, he's a slimeball, but if this year they are going to ignore General Petraeus(who really has affected the news coming out of Iraq), or even their dear friend ALGore, who, even if he is a lying shyster, is affecting the news greatly. One would think they'd go with Ahmanutjob or Chaves the Commie Bastard. Putin does need more coverage, but as Man/Person of the year, he is nearly as lacking as last year's winner.
And they didn't write him up as much of a slimeball either. They kinds glossed over some of the stuff (I have not read it all the way through, but they call his actions bringing stability by shutting down the opposition, etc...if Bush were to think fleetingly to pull that crap would they be so kind?) and he fares well to be another Stalin in many ways (I don't think he could get away with Stalin's Purges, though he probably wishes he could) so in years to come, he may get mentioned, like former "winners" Stalin, Hitler, and Ayatullah Khomeini when next they pick an Evil Winner.
Posted by: JP at December 19, 2007 06:07 PM (VxiFL)
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Frederick, sounds like you think that CY is under the impression that it's all great in Russia. However, I'd be interested to know how you can square that with his statement in the original post cited the deaths of 17 journalists.
Or are you, rather, the one that is attempting to make the claim that everything is just fine in Russia?
Posted by: C-C-G at December 20, 2007 12:41 AM (4tS0i)
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[...] or even their dear friend ALGore, who, even if he is a lying shyster [...]
Al Gore would have to pass the Bar Exam to be a shyster.
Posted by: rosignol at December 20, 2007 02:52 AM (A9g2a)
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C-C-G I'm saying that CY's insinuation that Time approves of what is going on in Russia is assine. Not being able to recognize the way Putin and Russia has driven events during the last decade, and see what novanom pointed out earlier in the thread is the height of tone deafness. Kasparov explains it well in the clip I linked to.
Posted by: Frederick at December 20, 2007 09:10 AM (tupRm)
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http://www.time.com/time/covers/0,16641,19390102,00.html
You know, CY, there's a case to be made that they chose the wrong guy because Putin isn't really all that influential, and if he is, 2007 wasn't the year that really symbolized the peak of his influence. But listing Putin's atrocities as if they're a reason not to pick him just makes your ignorance of all things more plain -- the award is about influence, not about whether they actually like the guy, as the link above shows. All you've accomplished here is looking like a whiner.
Posted by: Alex at December 20, 2007 11:57 AM (SezHo)
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A "Man of year" award always implies a level of approval.
--Not for nuthin', but didn't Hitler get it in the Thirties? Maybe they're not commies per se, just toadies and lickspittles generically. If Bush were the tyrant the Left makes him out to be he'd get it every year.
Meanwhile, as for Putin, what big effect exactly has he had? Don't confuse genius with $90 oil. He kills dissidents, OK. Plays footsie with foreign dictators like Ahmadinejad, OK. Tries to punk the neighbors e.g. Georgia, OK. And...what? Regained military parity with the West? Reversed the demographic landslide in Russia? Turned water into wine?
In Russia they say, The moujiks crave the knout (i.e. the lash, or more precisely the club). I think Time craves the knout.
Posted by: nichevo at December 20, 2007 02:04 PM (Ak+g8)
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I guess I have to explain things to far left wing fanatical kooks like David. Read carefully, obviously Putin had little if any influence in the world during 2007, I figured everyone knew that. Therefor to have an avowed Communist and ex KGB member as "Man of the Year" solidifies my previous comment. The intellectual vacancy of the left is stunning!
Posted by: Capitalist Infidel at December 20, 2007 03:22 PM (Lgw9b)
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The intellectual vacancy of the left is stunning!
Shouldn't be. Anyone with a functioning cerebellum who actually uses it should be able to see, for instance, that you can't win a war by surrendering, that you can't raise prosperity by taking money away from people, and that you can't stop terrorists by searching blue-haired grandmas at airports.
Leftism is the refuge of those who cannot or will not use their grey matter.
Posted by: C-C-G at December 20, 2007 07:42 PM (4tS0i)
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Time's picks always make them look the fool later.
With the disclosure of Putin's billions in the days following the Time pick, they have done it again.
Posted by: Neo at December 24, 2007 11:24 AM (Yozw9)
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December 18, 2007
Sad But True
The difference between the
New York Times defense of Associated Press photographer/terrorist suspect Bilal Hussein and the John Edwards
love child scandal in
The National Enquirer is that there is little reason to suspect that predisposed biases may play a role in the
Enquirer story.
The Times coverage of Hussein's incarceration—which like the eerily similar Associated Press coverage before it, skips over the fact that Hussein attempted to hide his identity after being captured, and tries to make the normal workings of the Iraqi justice system appear biased against Hussein—is hardly objective.
But then, we didn't expect it to be.
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Serving up another portion of predisposed biases...The Other Fallujah Reporter
Link: http://www.windsofchange.net/archives/the_other_fallujah_reporter.php
Merry Christmas and I sure have appreciated reading you this year.
Posted by: The Albatross at December 19, 2007 05:36 PM (TK3vU)
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What happened to your other Edwards article? I left a post this morning and left a Fox News article that stated Edwards was leading Iowa, now gone.......????? More editing....
Posted by: John at December 19, 2007 09:09 PM (HTxzA)
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Unfortunately, the National Inquirer has a greater record of accuracy than the New York Times.
Posted by: miriam at December 22, 2007 10:13 PM (Zp7CU)
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You Gotta Be Kidding Me...
On Drudge:
There is nothing presently on National Enquirer web site right now, but even if there was... would it matter?
Even if true—and I don't think that it is—Edwards is something of a non-factor as a candidate polling well behind Clinton's 42% and Obama's 26% in the RCP poll average of Democratic candidates with just 13% of the vote.
This is stupid news, and more than likely non-news... pretty much like the Edwards campaign thus far.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
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i'd like the three of them - silky, elizabeth and the bimbette - to appear on jerry springer or maury povich and have them get a paternity test!
Posted by: reliapundit at December 18, 2007 07:34 PM (EyYCl)
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You miss the point, CY. The article was posted to let us know that (once more) the prancing pony has procreated...a very scary turn of events.
If true, this is a horrible turn of events for mankind--and means that Edwards has come to the conclusion that if he isn't elected President--he will flood the world with his genetically inferior progeny.
And as conservative "right to life" supporters, we stand no chance against his diabolical progenious onslaught.
Oh waily, waily, waily....
Posted by: WB at December 18, 2007 07:58 PM (XdzSt)
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What the sinister media conspirators chose not to tell you is that the lady is hiding in the Kremlin basement in the room between the ones containing Adolf Hitler and the space aliens. Convenient, is it not, that the Weekly World News all of a sudden has no print edition? Mere coincidence? Yeah. Right.
Posted by: Bleepless at December 18, 2007 09:28 PM (bAYPp)
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Curiously, a Clintonite runs the Enquirer.
Posted by: Purple Avenger at December 18, 2007 09:52 PM (wWoFq)
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As long as it isn't Elvis' Alien Love Baby we're still ahead of the game.
WB- Nac Mac Feegle!
Posted by: DaveP. at December 19, 2007 07:58 AM (ztWD8)
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It was the Enquirer that broke the Lewinsky story. And if it turns out that Silky was cheating on his dying-of-cancer yet still-on-the-campaign-trail wife, well...ask Newt Gingrich. It's not going to play well with the ladies. News of the affair itself has been
around for a while so this may not be a real stretch.
Posted by: Pablo at December 19, 2007 09:34 AM (yTndK)
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Bbbbbut I thought Edwards was a fag, a girly man, the Breck girl?
Oh, now he's a manly man who has kids out of wedlock.
Keep reaching, repubtards. If this is the best you can do, the WH race will be a walk in the park.
Posted by: Silvio at December 19, 2007 04:52 PM (lsb0p)
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I see early this morning you deleted your Edwards bashing stories following this one. I left you an article straight from the lion's den, Foxnews, stating Edwards now leads Iowa in the latest poll. All deleted. Up to your old editing games again?
Posted by: john bryan at December 19, 2007 08:04 PM (HTxzA)
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Edwards for President, Inc.
On January 2, 2003,
Under Finance-
"Director of Operations Andrew Young
Has been with Senator Edwards in various capacities since 1998. North Carolina native."
http://www.gwu.edu/~action/2004/edwards/edworg.html
Posted by: moremeaning at December 20, 2007 02:03 AM (Vtop3)
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I agree. This is Edwards attempt to expand beyond the "poofy men" demographic.
Posted by: donmeaker at December 20, 2007 09:37 PM (RXNGp)
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Journalism is Hard
Babak Dehghanpisheh has an article posted in
Newsweek today that once again shows just how careless the media is in its Iraq reporting in an article called, "
The "Body Contractors.'"
The article itself is interesting, in that it notes that both violence is down and that those killing Iraqis are taking greater care to hide the bodies of those they kill. As a result of the recent trend of hiding bodies, mutahid al juthath—body contractors—charges clients between $300-$500 to hunt down missing relatives whether they are alive, or as the title of the article implies, dead.
The problem with Dehghanpisheh's reporting, however, is that he cites as examples of on-going massacres at least one event that simply never took place.
He writes:
In the past two months, more than half a dozen mass graves have been found in Iraq, at least half of them in Baghdad. At one site discovered in late November, in a yard in Baghdad's Saydiya neighborhood, bodies and their severed heads were buried in two separate holes, according to a source at the Ministry of Interior who isn't authorized to speak on the record. An additional 16 bodies were found buried in a ditch north of Baghdad last Thursday.
The 16 bodies "found buried in a ditch north of Baghdad last Thursday" never existed, according to American forces in the area that state:
This appears to false reporting. We currently have no information to confirm this. Neither the Brigade on the ground, or out teams that work with the IA or IPs can confirm this.
It is too much to ask reporters to ask anonymous sources for proof of their claims?
When it comes to reporting the dead in Iraq, apparently so.
Posted by: Confederate Yankee at
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Even if a grave were found it is not an immediate need story to put onto the presses. If they took even a couple of days to have a PAO double check and then release the story then fine.
It is really not a time sensitive story that would justify such a rush to print.
Also it would give the opportunity to either add credibility to their stringer/sources or lower them as the case warrants.
At least the false lead stories would be minimized and their credibility would not be taking the hits simply due to rushing a story that is truly not a time sensitive breaking one.
Posted by: Observer at December 19, 2007 12:14 AM (1aM/I)
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Also it would be hard to consider that even a stringer or even a tipster doesn't have a photo capable cellphone and possibly mail in or bring in some solid proof.
Posted by: Observer at December 19, 2007 12:17 AM (1aM/I)
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It's become far too common for an "anonymous source" to be used to print fabrications where there really is no
valid source. By making the source anonymous, the source's lack of validity is hidden quite effectively.
In fact, it is quite possible for a reporter to be his/her own "anonymous source," which raises all sorts of questions.
I do not question that occasionally it is necessary to grant a truly valid source anonymity, but the privilege has been abused and needs to be reined in.
Posted by: C-C-G at December 19, 2007 12:42 AM (4tS0i)
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Nah, journalism is easy. You just sit around in a bar and make up crap.
Posted by: David at December 19, 2007 10:47 AM (cPLO6)
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It's only easy to sit around at the bar making up crap when there's a Narrative to follow, otherwise the drinks get in the way and you wind up at the National Enquirer desk.
Posted by: DirtCrashr at December 19, 2007 01:49 PM (VNM5w)
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Yes, The Narrative is everything. The Narrative says that there must be mass graves and shooting in Iraq, therefore that is what gets printed. They use an "anonymous source" because they can't find any real sources to corroborate their story, and that's because--guess what!--their story is
WRONG!
Posted by: C-C-G at December 19, 2007 08:34 PM (4tS0i)
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